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Project CARS – Sign Ups Likely To Be Closed Soon

New WMD member sign ups for Project CARS will likely be closed soon – Find out why.

Back in October 2011, Slightly Mad Studios launched World of Mass Development, a unique portal to fund their upcoming Project CARS title that enables gamers to follow and influence the development of a AAA title from the very beginning.

The concept has been a huge success as almost half a million Euros have been pitched in by members so far, allowing the studio to create a racing simulation based on the community’s wishes and ideals without pressure from a publisher. In return for their financial commitment, members don’t just get to follow the development and try regular development versions but they’ll also get a share of the title’s financial return as well.

There are some significant changes in store though as Slightly Mad Studios will most likely see a big change in company structure during the coming weeks, the studio will be becoming part of something much bigger if everything goes according to plan.

This development will have a very positive effect on Project CARS as it will most likely ensure the full funding needed to complete the development. On the other hand, this will likely result in WMD tool pack signups for Project CARS to be shut down.

What does this mean? Starting from this point that will happen sometime in the next 2-3 weeks, WMD won’t be accepting any new members for the remaining course of the title’s development. So if you want to be part of Project CARS, now’s the time to join WMD or upgrade to a higher tool pack.

The new scenario won’t mean that the original WMD concept is altered though, all existing members stay on board and keep their rights and benefits, the community will just be closed off as additional funding won’t be needed anymore.

Project CARS is still many months away from being released and if you want to be part of the title’s development and enjoy regular development builds, now’s the time to act and join – Otherwise your next chance to enjoy Project CARS will be when it hits the shelves in 2013.

Membership on Project CARS starts at a one-time payment of 10€ for the Junior tool pack, followed by 25€ for Team Member status and 50€ for Full membership. New users can register here, more info on the different membership levels and their benefits can be found here.

 

  • http://www.facebook.com/jukka.karppinen1 Jukka Karppinen

    Time to invest 25e more-> full membership.

  • http://twitter.com/zudthespud zudthespud

    Seems like a weird move but fair enough. I’m very happy with my team member package.

  • http://www.facebook.com/Siggers Ross Siggers

    If I can spare the cash I might go full member, not such a big leap from my team member status atm.

  • Anonymous

    looks like SMS doesn’t call the shots anymore recently some investment company bought 60% stake of SMS.
    full article here
    http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20120216005567/en/MyLoadBase-N.V.-purchases-stake-Slightly-Mad-Studios
    “Michele Pes added: “We will consolidate all technology rights and
    business development in Singapore. We will be at the heart of Asia, the
    fastest growth market of all for entertainment products. Our team of
    experts is recruiting outstanding talent worldwide, but in Singapore we
    are clearly demonstrating the significance of Asia as a market for
    computer and video games.”

    I am just speculating but this could be bad if those investors demand mass selling game aka shift 1 and shift 2.

    • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

      I don’t think the plan will be altered that much, as the article says, they have the funding they now need to complete the project, by continuing to receive members, they effectively reducing their profit once the final product goes on sale, if only for that reason, I agree with the decision.

    • sam.stratten

       Yeah, because Asia is the dominant force in gaming. Welcome to 10 years ago. If they think moving to Asia will get them better results then God help us all. Look at GT5. Japanese developers have forgotten what it takes to make a good game. If you base yourself in Asia you’re only going to atract developers from that area.

      • http://twitter.com/StarFoXySxv550 StarFoXySxv550

        Have to agree with that statement. Unless they have a team lead or major influences inside the team working outside of their region, they seem to forget the rest of the world exists and the product alienates everybody except the odd few people that can like with their (quirky? stale?) game design philosophies.

        But Asia is where all the new money is these days, the growth there is outdoing the west at a rapid rate right now, in most cases.

    • Anonymous

      Yeah, when I posted that link in an article a month ago, nobody cared. When I sent it to Montoya as a tip it didn’t make it to front page. It will be very interesting to see the effects of this purchase.

      • Anonymous

        It didn’t make the frontpage because the article doesn’t say what you think it says because you don’t read carefully enough.

      • Anonymous

        What did I think it said? Some company bought a 60% share in the part of SMS developing pCARS. Whether it is good/bad/changes development is up to everyone to know, but I would have thought such a big financial change in a company trying out a brand new community funded effort would be of note to many people. I’m not some doom and gloom chicken little claiming this is the downfall of SMS, I simply thought this was an interesting development and given that the financials and lack of publisher financing was one of the primary talking points about pCARS, why wouldn’t we want to talk about this, no prejudice of good or bad?

        No need to condescend to my ‘not reading it carefully enough’. Your site and you can choose to post whatever you want, but if you’re going to tell me it says something different than what I thought (as if you know), why not enlighten me with what the press release actually means as understood by a careful reader? I’m honestly curious what it means, please help me out here. Is this a compartmentalized purchase or what?

      • Anonymous

        You aren’t going to tell me what this article actually means, or are you still trying to spin it?

        If you just don’t do business stories, say that. If it didn’t seem relevent, say that. Don’t give me crap when I wonder aloud why nobody else seemed interested in the story that I misinterpreted it, though.

    • http://twitter.com/ipitydafool Andrew

      Investment houses/ share holders don’t usually interfere in the running of a company.  The board of the company does.  That’s how companies work.  The board of directors sets out the companies strategy not the shareholders.

  • 1337 1337

    Bye bye hopes of a great new car game!!!

    • Anonymous

      Which part of “the WMD concept is not going to change” were you unable to understand?

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37618905 Brandon Warren

        It hasn’t been confirmed if the concept will be altered or not. The only thing Mr. Bell said was that the terms and conditions would remain unchanged and everyone would receive the agreed benefits. This is a wishy washy statement and needs some clarification. I haven’t seen anything that says that the WMD concept will be unaltered. Unless your privy to information the rest of us aren’t? 

      • Anonymous

        Ian has specifically said that the influence members have now will be kept as he considers it to be a dealbreaker when it comes to the new arrangement.

        What exactly are you afraid of?

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37618905 Brandon Warren

        I am not afraid of anything regarding pCARS I am just seeking information and hoping that the concept stays consistent when this new move takes place. We will see what happens. Can you source that piece of information where he specifically says that? 

      • Eric Zehnder

         There are over 20 pages of confirmation waiting for you on the forums…

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=37618905 Brandon Warren

        At this time Eric I think it helps to remain skeptical when a merger like this happens. I have already noticed the pCARS community are like that but there is a very real possibility that this could happen and happen legally. 

      • Eric Zehnder

         I’m a bit skeptical but they are only looking for something like $2Mil which is a good amount of money, to be sure, but is nothing in comparison to what Codemasters pays for it’s games to be developed or what the Shift series costs. Ian Bell is obviously very conscious of how this will play with the community in house and at large if things start changing for the worse.

      • Anonymous

        And iRacing 2.0 came out as announced with all features last August, that’s why all the cars have the new tire model…

        We can’t be skeptical of developer announcements anymore?

      • http://twitter.com/Michael_42 Michael

        The part of the story that shows it’s clearly changing (and changed in the past)

    • Anonymous

      what ‘hopes of a great new car game’ would that be?

  • Anonymous

    As long as there isn’t some nasty contract for anybody who isn’t a full member getting chucked out in the future for not upgrading. Chipping in just £8.33ish for everything is a super deal. I will probably sign up this week. Sorry rF2, my cash is short.

  • Anonymous

    Would people have signed-up if they knew this would happen?

    It seems a bit ‘off’ to invite people to buy into some new concept of game development, only to transform into a traditional corporate form half-way through the project.    The terms of the deal have totally changed.

     If the traditional model for financing development and publishing was so bad – and this new model so good and necessary – why change back now?

    • Anonymous

      The current structure of this project will not change. The only thing that will change is full funding will be met which has always been the main goal. As far as future SMS titles we shall see when that time comes and that might be soon since they have close to complete projects sitting on the shelf already.

      • Anonymous

        Well, we shall see……

        They still have to get over Shift before they have any credibility as a serious developer of driving “sims”. I don’t think anybody doubts the beauty – for that they deserve serious kudos. But there’s a lot more to it than that. So…..we shall see.

      • Anonymous

        The Original SimBin!!!

      • Anonymous

        GTL GTR 1+2 were gmotor games – ISI developed gmotor, not SimBin.

    • Eric Zehnder

      Worst Case Scenario:
      I paid for a game 1 year in advance while getting to watch and influence the development process, physics, and content. Most people just pay for a game and play it.

      I don’t feel cheated.

      • Anonymous

        Aside from going boxed retail, and some beta testing, how have members really steered pCARS? I’m not a member, but aside from those two things, I haven’t really heard where members have told SMS to do something different and they have. Can someone enlighten me?

      • Eric Zehnder

        -The number of cars in the finished game.
        -If certain track/track types should be restricted to DLC/higher members or included in the full game.
        -What controllers to focus on support right away or later on (Logitech G27 vs ECCI, let’s say).
        -How to deliver the finished product, additional content, etc.
        -Car/Track combo for possible demo down the line.
        -How quick race grids work out.
        -How the racing line is displayed (aid).
        -Control method for menus.
        -Changing of “tool packs”.
        -Voting of logos and general game art.

        That’s just the ancillary stuff and I’m missing quite a bit. The core of the experience right now is giving detailed feedback and possible bug reports on every new build. When a new build comes out you load it up and see how everything feels in relation to last week. More often than not there are a few new tracks and cars and they need to be tuned.

        My breakdown usually lists what stands out to me. So if I feel like FFB has really improved on a particular car I’ll mention it and give an example area/act that lets people see it for themselves (like going deep into a particular corner and feeling understeer build).

        There’s also a ton of discussion on how the high downforce cars need work on low speed grip and high speed handling and weight transfer.

        What I’ve liked about this is that these discussion are always heavily populated by the developers so you really are talking to them and they’re listening to your suggestions. Quite a few team member suggestions are making it in to builds and the final product. Some team members have contributed things like software to have multiple builds installed at the same time without issue or tools to easily create new liveries.

        Anyway, it’s easily worth the $10 for monthly builds and I’ve gone for the “Full Member” level cause I want weekly builds and the full game / certain DLC for free at the end of this.

      • Anonymous

        Cool, thanks for that.

        If only I had spare time and dispoasable income… 🙁

      • Anonymous

        You don’t?      Not yet, at least.

        Therefore everyone in the universe feels the same, presumably?

      • http://twitter.com/Michael_42 Michael

        But you didn’t pay for the game. That was the first thing they decided to try and get some more cash out of people – that the money you had paid wasn’t buying the game unless you paid more to join some new tier.

      • Anonymous

        It was very clear what that first tier got you. They never said it got you the final game. It got you a discount for the final game of whatever you’ve already paid in. Extremely fair, if you ask me. Especially when you consider you could play the game for the entire length of the Alpha/Beta and then get a refund before it came out and have played all the while for free.

    • Anonymous

       Curt,  I’m sorry man I have to say this.  I can’t look at your nick without first thinking it says something else 🙂    No offense m8 🙂  

      Maybe I need to enlarge the text size for this website in Firefox.

      • Anonymous

        LOL

      • Anonymous

        What *could* you mean?

      • Anonymous

          LOL, sorry man.  I think my on-screen letters are just too close together 🙂

  • http://twitter.com/xxHojoxx xxHojoxx

    For me the community aspect part of the project hasn’t been enough, especially content wise where it has been rather railroaded. Take the track selection, most are from an existing library of previous SMS titles, plus the cars in the game are rather random with no complete series yet, and little discussion on the matter. New cars/tracks just seem to appear as and when. 

    The devs seem to have made there mind up on 95% of things already, and have an army of supporters all chasing the $$$$$$$$$$ carrying them along, what is really needed is some honest unbiased opinion and feedback, but this is hard to find as the majority involved have a financial agenda. The fact is the game is heavily bassed on the old Madness engine, that was developed for the Shift series, and SMS are attempting to make a proper simulation out of it, good luck with that. In all the builds I’ve tried up to the latest it hasn’t fully lost it’s Shiftness and I doubt it ever will. By reusing and tweaking an old engine, plus using previous content and assets, the costs are low, and by tapping into the multiplatform console market the potential financial gains are high.

    What I was hoping for was a modern genre defining simulation, with accurate uncompromised physics, pure FFB from the steering column, laser scanned tracks, and licensed racing series that includes multiple manufacturers within the series. This level of simulation appears unlikely, and I personally feel rather duped as a PC sim racer for helping to fund the title, as I can’t see this game developing into what I want it to be.   

    • Anonymous

      If they were to move the FFB to the steering column i think it would improve the feel so much. Really rF2 feels a different league to pCARS. To be fair rF2’s FFB completely blows every sims FFB away but more so pCARS than anything. Bare in mind i have not used pCARS since build 160 but it never felt convincing to me, it showed glimpses of being good, braking feels nice. I keep reading posts saying it’s been improved again so maybe it’s different now but from all the time i spent with the sim i was always reading the same and it never changed drastically.

      • Anonymous

        FFB is mostly steering column based now. From following the physics threads, they’re going to make changes to the tyre model that are going to carry through to the FFB. 

        Yea other sims are probably more immersive to race in at the moment but that’s really just due to pCARS being unfinished with many features not being implemented yet. When the pit stops, pit2car radio, better AI, and more cool stuff comes in, it’s going to get a whole lot more fun.

        Oh and that 20km country road is coming on Friday, hell yes!

      • http://twitter.com/xxHojoxx xxHojoxx

        I agree it is improving, but there are still too many other forces and effects masking the important things. Spring effect is over used and the tyre forces feel canned, plus the steering column forces are too weak when they should be the centerpiece of the FFB. Maybe there is a reason for this and it’s related to the physics/geometry, steering column forces only work well if everything else in the chain is modelled and working correctly.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Alex-White/655487760 Alex White

        It could be the fact that the new ffb system … is new? 🙂

      • http://www.facebook.com/jcruze88 Justin ForzaBarça Cruze

         Pretty unfair to comment on it based on an old build……you should know these things can change dramatically between builds at this stage. 
        As Matt said FFB is now taken directly from the steering column. Its still not perfect as is the case with anything newly implemented but it WILL be improved.

      • Anonymous

        Fair enough i understand your point and to be fair i did say bare in mind i had not played it since build 160. But still the core mechanics and physics of the game are just not there and it’s because the focus is on getting the visuals to be the main attraction. You can feel the difference between a sim that has focussed on the driving feel first and foremost. Yes, the builds do change weekly but never dramatically. Like i said it’s ok having the FFB from the column but you also need top line physics and tracks that feel and alive and they are breathing to really show off that FFB. Who knows in the future though what they will be able to do.

      • http://www.facebook.com/jcruze88 Justin ForzaBarça Cruze

        Yeah I’ve seen your vids about pCARS (and your rF2 vids, very nice) so I know you’re only being honest with your opinion.

        These discussions about physics and FFB…….they’re always tricky because everyone seems to have a different opinion and it all seems way too subjective.
        You’ve got people who swear by iracing, people who swear by rF2, people who swear by NKP, people who swear by GPL (seriously), etc…….

        Anyway, my benchmark remains NKP and pCARS definitely doesnt feel as good at this stage.
        However, to me it definitely drives like a sim and not like a game……and this is with a great deal of development time still to go.

      • Anonymous

        Exactly mate you are correct when it comes to physics they are extremely subjective. I have tried in all honesty to stay away from the pCARS threads so it didn’t seem as if i was just hating for no reason. The only reason i did reply as the ” Shiftyness ” comment which i don’t feel is right. It feels alot more advanced than the SHIFT series and still has like you say a long way to go. But still the SHIFT games are not really hard to beat as they were so broke, so anything is an improvement.

        It was the same with Simbins race/GTR EVO series they just never convinced me in comparison to NKP and the HQ rF1 mods.

        Th reason i did not mention NKP before in my last post was that while i agree 100% in terms of FFB and physics it was THE sim of the last generation it always for me lacked immersion. And so while for me the older versions of iRacing where like ice skating, something it always had was immersion, sitting on the line at the start of a race i always felt like i was part of something. I get the same feeling with rF2, feels completely immersed in the sim environment because they have the feel, track feel, track atmospheres and all those little details completely nailed.

        I never felt immersed in pCARS apart from WOW look at the textures, just felt like a game.

  • Anonymous

    That’s why I love VirtualR they keep it straight up and to the point.

  • Matt Orr

    Uhh, why?

    If people are willing to pay and the project has been funded, why not continue receiving more funding that can be used most certainly?

    just seems odd that it starts as “Help fund our project and have a say”, then becomes “Cool, we have enough funding and don’t want any more.”

    • Big Ron

       Maybe it would be unfair to receive more money from the community while it isn´t needed.

    • Anonymous

      Same reason companies stop offering additional shares of stock, so the returns per share don’t get spread too thin.

  • Paul Mullins

     They lost me when they mentioned it will be ported to consoles..  that flags this is no longer a sim but a game.

    • Anonymous

       That’s been the case since day 1, it’s not new news.

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001061294656 Rhys Gardiner

      There is no reason that a sim can’t be ported to consoles while retaining its sim-like elements. Look at RACE Pro – sure, it wasn’t the best in other areas, but from what I’ve heard SimBin retained much of the physics characteristics of GTR Evo.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_DPB22Q3UKZGB5HLQJZFDD3MQEE Phantom Mark

        100% was translated into Race Pro, there was nothing dumbed down for it at all….I see no reason why people get the jitters about a console port, the only thing which will change will be generally be more aggressive LODS, maybe some cutting back of model quality, texture sharpness and sizes, the clock speed of the physics may well have to slowed a little but also depends where it is currently at already in any case, no reason for the ethos to change whatsoever.

      • Anonymous

        The issue is when a game/engine starts as a console game/engine the physics are built ground up around a joystick rather than a wheel.
        ( as that’s what the majority of the player base will be playing the game with)

        If a game/engine is built ground up around a wheel then its easy to lock down aspects of the physics for joystick and simply turn those assists off when you then play with a wheel. 
        Its very apparent to me that C.A.R.S engine and controls were original designed around a joystick/gamepad the handling has similar traits to  Forza , F1 2011 , NFS  , Granted they have improved the way the cars move and its not quite as binary as those games but its physics are still wonky. One of the most noticeable and telling aspects of games built around a joy pad for console is the way the games handle counter steering  and the lack of the ability to procicely control the angle of the back end through and into corners with the game having very definative points of grip loss and locked in drifting. 

        The exact same thing happens with FPS games when an FPS is designed around a console and then ported to pc the aiming will be sluggish, yet if its a pc fps ported to console it can work totally fine on both platforms. 

        and again an arcade fighting game will ultimately play best with a clicky arcade stick and buttons as that’s what the initial game play is designed around and it will feel sluggish on a game pad or with pc keyboard.

    • pez2k .

      A console port has been intended since day one. While I still can, I must suggest you buy in as a Junior and please try it for yourself before idly slagging things off.

    • Big Ron

       what a bs shit are you talking? PC is lead platform and the most important platform to translate their plans. The console port will be a slightly stripped version of what is availabl on PC. There isn´t anything, which is limited because of the consoles.

      So think about that and inform yourself a bit better before spreading such nonsense.

      • Anonymous

        You couldn’t tell him that in a nicer way or did you just take an instant dislike to him ?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Jason-Garrett/100001190916179 Jason Garrett

    All this means is that some big company is coming onboard with lots of money and resources. The problem with big investors, is you have to meet the needs of the big investors. What ruined the Shift series? The fact that the parent company wanted to keep things simple enough so a 5 year old could play it and win. That’s the good part about small studios like ISI, the iRacing team, Simbin, etc. They don’t have “big brother” watching over their shoulders making “suggestions” (read: requirements) about features to change.

    I am holding out hope, but I fear now this will actually just become a slightly improved NFS: Shift.

    • Big Ron

       Ian Bell seems to have a big investor/ publisher, yes. But as he said: he has several points and conditions to which he insists. If the investor doesn´t agree with those points, there will be no contract.

  • Mate Boros

    So if I buy a junior membership now, I’ll still get all the monthly builds until the game is finished?

    • Big Ron

       Yes. If you get part of it till it gets closed, you´ll have all advatages of the excisting system.

    • Anonymous

      Who knows?

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/LTDTXXOXMP4ETNK2SX3QIFBTZE Francois

    this isn’t fair!!
    considering the growing numbers of drivers interested in the project…
    we may only hope for an online possibility soon!

  • Guilherme Cramer

    SMS could have sold 49% instead of 60%. 

    • Anonymous

       ach!  If only they’d known !  

      • Guilherme Cramer

        If only.

        😛

  • murpy eddie

    no good news for the community. how big is the share of all the members together as a whole? not much i guess + its split between thousands different people with different agendas. sms’s is not big now either so it will be under the control of its biggest investor. 

    • Guilherme Cramer

      While I understand your point, I don’t believe the main concern here is the amount of money would be received in return.

      SMS and Simbin seem to love recycling old material, I really hope CARS fulfills all it wishes to, but we have to be realistic. As mentioned before, this seems like an updated Shift instead of a new platform. Car models, tracks, who knows how much is generated 100% from scratch for the current platform that is Project CARS.

      I’d have liked to jump in the bandwagon and pay at least the minimum fee to enjoy the beta builds but I have been fooled by SMS before and there’s nothing here – TO ME – to prove they wouldn’t fool me again. Also as mentioned by others, we rarely see new developments that seem to have been selected by the community. I certainly hope that it just hasn’t been enough time to build up community input from scratch, but if in the next 3 months (my guess here) we don’t see that changing, then I’d be concerned.

      Lastly, I do not like Project CARS suggested price point. In the current market it’s difficult to defend a PC game costing more than $39 dollars/$30-35 Euros. As I said, DEFEND, I am well aware there are several titles above that range. And the Euro pricing isn’t a conversion from the dollar value, it’s based on historical prices in the old continent.

      • murpy eddie

        the money return is not important for me either. it’s about how much power the community has to push pcars in the direction they want it. not much i guess.
        ok im not a member but i try every build my buddy gets and planned to jump in if it gets close to what i like.

      • Anonymous

         If you’d joined from the start and put in some feedback, it already might have been closer to what you like.
        You can’t not be a member and then complain its not going in your direction.   The whole idea is that you can, as a member, at least provide your thoughts and feedback.   How much of that gets heard amongst a thousand voices is another thing, but at least you’re there with a say.
        Waiting around for it to get close to what you like, might be a long wait for you.

      • murpy eddie

        i can complain here because i played it. i just can’t voice my opinion on it in the wmd forum.

        but it really isnt about me its about the pcars members. i mean selling 60% of a company is a big deal which very well could effect the outcome of the endproduct. 

      • Anonymous

         Playing it isn’t the issue.  We can all do that.  But as a member you get to be a voice during the development.  No voice, then no-one is listening to you.

        Yes selling 60% could affect the outcome indeed.   But it seems you are assuming in a negative way.   These people are hardly EA.  That 60% means extra funds and extra funds might inject even more life into pCARS.  

        Too much ‘glass half empty’ thinking around here.

      • Anonymous

        How do you know? We know nothing at this moment!

      • Anonymous

        If it is a good thing, why wasn’t it posted here officially when it first came through the press release channels? I agree, it could mean much easier funding tech transfer, etc. The question is why it isn’t discussed at all, or just assumed to be good.

        Remember when iRacing 2.0 was announced? The naysayers said there was no way everything would be released in August and they were right. We are still waiting six months later for the NTM on cars that were supposed to have been released then. A healthy dose of skepticism is a good thing, sometimes.

      • Anonymous

        “You can’t not be a member and then complain its not going in your direction.”====

        err…yes you can.    😉

      • Anonymous

         Well, you can, but then they’re just missing the whole point of what being a member was all about.
        I’d have no sympathy for them.

    • Anonymous

       That control is not going to be how the sim should turn out.  I think you’re worrying over nothing.

  • http://www.facebook.com/steve30x Steve Farrell

    This happens just as I pay for membership.

    • Anonymous

      So that’s a good thing.  You got yourself on board.     I dunno what people are worried about really.  They are sill going to have their input and feedback heard.   I seriously doubt SMS are about to start ignoring all their members or mess up what has been ongoing so far.
      I’m guessing this new investor is on-board because of the way the project is set-up and I don’t think SMS would do anything to pee-off the paying members now, do you ?

      I see only an upside to this.

      • Anonymous

        Well, we shall see.  

      • Anonymous

        Your an Idiot you obviously have not tried pCARS and have No idea that The SMS team was the original SimBin and did GTL GTR and GTR2 so I would say that says credibility for developing Race Sims

      • Anonymous

        That’d be “you’re an idiot”, btw.

        GTL, GTR and GTR2 were all based on ISI’s gmotor engine.   ISI developed that engine, not SimBin, not SMS.

      • Anonymous

        I still say that your commenting on something you have not even tried or was one of the early ones banned from the project so you don’t know what your talking about thus where the idiot tag comes from. So you also do not give any credit to Reiza or Ignite for using Gmotor? They are not developers of race sims? If anyone thinks what they did means nothing truely is an idiot!

      • Anonymous

        Neither Reiza or Ignite are really “developers”.   If they were they wouldn’t have to rely on ISI’s gMotor engine – they’d have their own.  

        They deserve credit – but only for what they’ve done – not for what they haven’t.  And they haven’t produced a game engine, rather they’ve licenced someone else’s (ISI’s gMotor) and modified it (a little.)  Such folks are entrepreneurial super-modders, not developers.    As such, we don’t have anything by which to judge them as ‘developers’.  

      • Anonymous

        Okay just remember there is more to development than a game engine. Yes these developers Use the ISI technologies (Gmotor is a grapics engine and one that is getting dated) and have done well with them. As far as SMS and Madness it has very much been transformed away from what it was with Shifts and TDFL. You sound like your a fan of ISI Ian Bell and Doug Arnao use to work very closely with them on ISI’s earlier titles and Doug is doing the fine tuning on pCARS physics. Yes they are still working out bugs. It’s a title in Alpha stages and much time more to work on it. If you count them out you are making a big mistake because they do know how to release a quality product.

      • Anonymous

        Like I said…..We shall see.    😉

        They deserve – and have received – kudos for their visuals.  They’ve raised the bar, enormously.  Only a fool could fail to notice it, and bravo to them for having done so.  

        But – and it’s a big but –  it’s quite a different thing to produce lovely visuals than it is to produce a convincing simulation of driving and racing, nevermind multiplayer, AI, weather, mods, etc.

        I hope they confound all the critics.   But I’ve been around the block, and…..beautiful visuals tend to detract from the most important things – in this case, simulation of a car’s physics.   There are only so many processor cycles……

        And yes, I am an unashamed fan of ISI and gmotor – it’s provided by far the best platform these last 7(?) years – hell, it’s still going.   It will go down as bigger and better than GPL.   Obviously? 😉

      • Anonymous

        I think you missed the point Curt. Doug Arnao did a lot for the physics of ISI’s F1 series Nascar Thunder Series and rFactor. Also Simbin’s GTL, GTR, and GTR2 and now pCARS. He did do the Shift Series and even said he had to be slapped out of that mindset where it concerns pCARS. Like I said Gmotor is a graphics engine and goes back quite a bit more than 7 years. If you really want to classify ISI’s game engine call it the ISI Technologies Gjon’s own words. As for me I am a fan of many developers and many Sim Titles going back quite a ways. While I do like some better than others I still try to give each one the credit they deserve. If you really want to give an honest open minded opinion buy a tool pack and start using pCARS for yourself then you can say what you like and since it be a true evaluation I would respect that. Till then does not mean much.

      • Anonymous

        We shall see.

        Every criticism is dismissed as “this is a pre-alpha, wait til it’s finished”.  Funny how that doesn’t work for the fans’ views – somehow the fans appreciation is legitimate, despite pre-alpha status – but criticism isn’t, because of pre-alpha status.  Funny.

      • Anonymous

        Constuctive criticism is welcomed because it helps fix bugs and enhance the software. Trolling is not. People think that if they get a freeze the whole thing is messed up we usually do get them when new content is added but lots of times it’s fixed by monday not 3 weeks down the road. The FFB is still a work in progress but if you work on your wheel settings the cars are very drivable. The physics are great don’t confuse physics with FFB. Me I’m just one that is enjoying the experience as a whole. I still love ISI, Kunos, SimBin along with many others. I’m just saying IMO this title will be top notch you can get in now or you can wait because there is a great chance it will be appealing to you when it is released

      • Anonymous

        For sure.    

        I’ll wait, thanks.    I’ve seen so many pretenders come and go……been at this since before REVS….and seen it all before.   The proof of the pudding is in the eating – we shall see.

      • 1337 1337

         You seem to have over confidence in dealing with investors, they want to se profit.. not FUN

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Markus-Ott/100000878526131 Markus Ott

    I don’t think it will happen that the big investor will make a forum account and fuck up every poll about the game. They apperently must have seen that the community is driving the game into the right direction, so why would they destroy this? SMS becomes part of “something bigger and better”, as they say, so the investor must be pleased with the work of SMS and how the WMD idea works.
    Moreover nothing changes. SMS did make clear very early that joining the project will be no more possible as soon as the have finished their funding.
    Right now the pCARS forum mostly is full of sim racers who know in which direction the game must go, so I am more than fine with the decision to close the gates and keep the community how it is now. When multiplayer kicks off, subs would have exploded, and probably some guys who want a Shift game or fancy stuff like a photomode would interrupt the development.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t see this as much of an issue, people already onboard will be part of something more exclusive overall, Can I just ask Markus are you personally involved in the project on a higher level? 

      The game is going in a good direction so hopefully it will continue to do so!

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Markus-Ott/100000878526131 Markus Ott

        I am just a normal team member. But fortunately the ideas and opinions match those of SMS most of the times. I never bought myself into the development because I stupidly thought SMS would make everything like the community wants to. It is more about new features and ideas that we can contribute and that SMS takes care of. Changes of the lightning for example. Things that online leagues need, how should the dedicated server software look like, do we need a console for the game. Those are the things that come from the community and those are the things that will make the difference.

    • Anonymous

      With the Poll weight there are already 2 or 3 members than can ”fuck up every poll about the game.”

      • Lemming asdfafh

        Not exactly. When things are close to 50/50, they can make the deciding vote. But they can still be outweighed by the majority.

    • http://twitter.com/Michael_42 Michael

      Not sure what you’re talking about Markus.

      There’s nothing in this game that hasn’t been in one or more racing games over the last 2 decades.

      They didn’t need any “community” telling them what to put in a racing game (and most of the features the game was going to have were specced using vacuous superlatives)

      All they needed from the community (prior to this new deal) was money, not ideas or “direction”. Really, if they’ve found the bulk of the money to develop the game elsewhere, you’ll just be an albatross around their necks now.

  • http://twitter.com/StarFoXySxv550 StarFoXySxv550

    1/2 a million euros, is that even enough to cover three or four track licenses?

    If the investments continued to come in that slowly I suspect they have no option but to do this, either that or the game probably wouldn’t get made at all.  

    • Anonymous

      bah, clicked ‘like’ by mistake instead of reply!

      ok, don’t forget that SMS have money to put in too.  You`ll see that detailed on the forums page.
      Plus, how many tracks are in pCARS with their proper name ?   Rouen.  Maybe that doesn’t cost anymore.   Who knows.

      • Anonymous

        You aren’t aware that clicking like again will remove your like?

      • Anonymous

         LOL, I wasn’t, no.   Didn’t even occur to me to try that 🙂   Thanks for the tip.

    • Ricoo

       With more than 150k€ /month it was enough to finance it until completion. And it would probably had increased when people see more and more quality content coming as in the two last weeks.

      Four track licences aren’t that costly fortunately. 🙂

    • http://twitter.com/Michael_42 Michael

      It’s very unlikely it was enough money given the figures they published before they started.

      It’s clear that there isn’t really enough consumer investment for them to have had any say. SMS have 3x more invested, not including whoever they’ve got to throw in some more.

      The mass development did get lots of mass debate, and the mass debaters invested more when they added the full member thing and folk realised they weren’t actually going to get a copy of the game for their so-called “not an investment”

      But clearly they realise it isn’t really viable after all. Otherwise they wouldn’t be binning it and going the traditional route. I wonder if they’d considered simply refunding the €500k. That may be counter-productive though given that these are the only people who are going to buy the game it might pee them off, so I guess they’ll keep them around.

  • http://www.facebook.com/matthias.lauer1 Matthias Lauer

    No thanx, i don´t need a new “SHIFT” named “P. CARS”! 😀

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Markus-Ott/100000878526131 Markus Ott

      Exactly right.
      Good example how trolling went wrong.

    • Anonymous

      How many times have we heard this phrase.  It’s getting tiring now and does nothing to change opinions that have already been formed.  
      If you don’t understand the difference between Shift and pCARS then you’re not qualified to make such comments.

  • Philip Samuelson

    This is an incredibly smart business decision. pCARS is likely to be the first in a series that will be put out(my business opinion strictly), and if they end up taking on too many investors, the dividends will be so minor that they will struggle to take on investments for future projects.

    If, however, they cut the investment list short, that increases dividends and when investors see what the dividends were for thge original, they can take on more investors in the future, which will provide funds for more licensed material and a much more expansive platform.

    I am an avid sim racer, but what we all must remember is that this game is also an investment and a business. If you simply signed on to have a say, you’ve misled yourself. Any time you spend money, you spend it to see a return. Sometimes that return is groceries at the supermarket. In this case, I spent my money to invest in a project. You can look at it as a static stock, the stock will rise to a ceiling and stop. They want that ceiling as high as they can get it so the dividends from the first version create a greater desire to invest in the future. Very simple concept, and incredibly intelligent.

    These are just my opinions, I have no idea if I’m right, I don’t claim to know anything other people don’t. Take it as you will — My two cents :).

    -Blacker.

    • Anonymous

      And all opinions on the quality of the product should be assessed with the above in mind ie those extolling the virtues of the game have a financial self-interest in doing so.

      Thanks for making that clear – as others have tried to claim this simply isn’t true and is unfair criticism. Obviously it is true, and it not unfair at all – “investors” do have a financial self-interest, so their views about the product must be understood in such terms.

      • Anonymous

        I could care less about the financial part of it I expect a copy and DLC with my 100 euro stake in the title that’s all. I feel anybody no matter what their favorite Sim Title is can try this and actually say that they totally hate it. Even in it’s pre-alpha state were not saying you’ll like it better than what your use to because everyone has their own preference. What I am saying is anyone with an open mind can find enjoyment in this title and already displays an overall quality of the title and it will only continue to get better. Don’t give up what your doing but maybe pCARS can enhance your enjoyment a bit.

      • Anonymous

        100 euros?   crikey.   Big money for a pre-alpha.

        No wonder people have a self-interest in it being considered “good”.   Be embarrassing to invest 100E in a dud.Of course, people can *say* that their own view isn’t influenced by personal self-interest, but nobody need believe them.  

      • Ricoo

        Most people put 100 € and even more because they think it’s good, exactly the opposite you claim.

      • Anonymous

        Good point.

        But how do you know what most people think?

      • Ricoo

         I read comments on WMD forums. 🙂

  • http://www.facebook.com/Angus944 Anthony Birch

    not for me thanks. i am 1 of hundreds who are on the verge of losing my job just because “investors/share holders” have to get their dividends, even though the company i work for makes a tidy profit, its being affected by a ‘sister’ company…….so in effect my future is in the hands of greedy people. i dont agree with the whole “share holder” expectations thing, i know i cant do anything about it …………..doesn’t mean i have to agree with it.

    • Philip Samuelson

      No doubt, I totally understand what you’re saying and absolutely when it comes to big business, I’m right there with you. Personally, I run a small business and a small business network… I operate on a monthly loss, so I’m not a big fan of the corporate sellouts that affect my livelihood either lol. You have a strong opinion, thanks for sharing it with us :).

      -Blacker.

      • Anonymous

        I agree I would rather see SMS stay independant if their financial structure shows it’s viable enough to do so. Anyway what has been said is their current project will not change so my mind is at ease about that and Ian has been as straight forward as he can be at this time. My overall concern for SMS is future developments when the new influences begin. Still I see Ian wanting to be in control of the development side and the new partners being more involved on the marketing side

      • Philip Samuelson

         You’ve made a great point IMO Birddogg, it will be interesting to see how SMS uses financial success in future developments. I do believe it would be a terrible tragedy if they break down the formula that has gotten them success and move to a traditional financial formula. That would be an awful idea.

        -Blacker.

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