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Project CARS – Junior Build 207 Available

Slightly Mad Studios have released the newest build of their WMD-powered Project CARS title, giving all members access to a spectacular new car.

Slightly Mad Studios have released the newest build of their WMD-powered Project CARS title, giving all members access to a spectacular new car.

Build 207 adds the Pagani Zonda R to Project CARS, the car is part of a partnership with Pagani that was announced yesterday and will see two other cars of the Italian manufacturer being added in the comings months.

Aside from the Zonda R, the new build also brings a first version of the Harrison Pike Raceway oval, a first pass at the title’s improved Force Feedback system and much more as you can see in the detailed changelogs below.

Build 207 (4/5/12, Junior Member+)
NEW PROFILE REQUIRED
Known Issues: Artifact appears on the steering wheel of the Zonda when in a high speed crash.
[listfeature]

  • Updated Fanatec CSW device ID and flipped operation of RPM lights to match latest version of the wheel
  • Added adjustment of aerodynamics influence while vehicle is in the air
  • Update various new profile defaults
  • Added new Bathurst HUD map
  • Stockcar_1990: All exterior mapped&textured, CPIT windscreen created, normals flipped,UV2 mapped, reflections texture added, user flag set .Some materials updates
  • Leonus 68 more robust driver back in(GT_classic) , changing gear animation added, roof camera position modified to show more of driver hands
  • Pagani Zonda R: pushrod positions matched to CAD. Fixes broken weight jacking effect of caster changes
  • Palmer JPLM: new suspension geometry for physics based on the model and photo references
  • Stockcar_1990: springs (front, rear) added
  • Pagani Zonda R: added custom liveries
  • BAC MONO: new liveries added
  • Added Zonda R
  • Stockcar 90: checks/fixes + prepared export with finished chassis textures
  • Pagani logo added to splash screen
  • News ticker updated with Pagani info
  • Derby: Balanced textures to not look so washed out
  • New Stockcar export
  • New Derby exports
[/listfeature] [toggle title=”Click Here To View The Changelogs Of All Builds Released During The Week”]Build 206 (3/5/12, Senior Manager)
First pass tweaks of the updated FFB to reasonably fit most vehicles until params are surfaced to the GUI
Per car FFB scaling reactivated
Add small amount of steering trail back to FFB, to weighten up understeer dropoff, and overall weight, a little
Re-add GUI tyre force modifier to per-car FFB formula. Also set defaults for this for all wheels to 100 (1.0, so no effect)
Fix for track select menu defaulting to right most layout instead of left
FFB: reduce base drag a little. More chance of oscillation but a better (more detailed) feel overall
Updated Fanatec CSW device ID and flipped operation of RPM lights to match latest version of the wheel
Asano LM11: Added missing AO to LODB and LODC, fixed missing damage to some parts; New export posted
BAC MONO: new liveries checked in
BAC MONO: new white rim
Rockford – Added Placeholder Kerb Textures for the oval
New AIW. Fixes cut track problems. Besos National
BAC MONO: added gold label color for livery#05
BAC MONO: new gold wheel
Harrison Pike speedway – Added tower building textures
Gumpert Apollo: camera positions and adjustment limits set. Fixed border issue on ambient shadow texture
Renamed oval to Harrison Pike Raceway
Harrison Pike Raceway logo updated
Besos – new textures checked in
New Asano LM11 export
New Besos exports
New Loire exports
New Harrison Pike Raceway export

Build 205 (2/5/12, Senior Manager)
Reinstate driver/wheel speed shake effects.
Integrated memory leak fix in Participant Gen
First pass tweaks of the updated FFB to reasonably fit most vehicles until params are surfaced to the GUI
Vehicles Materials Library. Fix for bodywork carbon matte materials
Added first Glencairn HUD map texture
Enabled all cockpit animations (only if present). Reduce steering shakes amount
Scaling direction vector to increase range of angles that are “front” versus “side”, and also fixes shadow calculation to take account of LOCK_Z – fixes odd shadow intersection issue on slopes
Added new Summerton HUD map
Alpha tweak for HUD map
New track map for HUD
Kart01, Kart02: updated animations for modified pedals, better fitting dirver seat
Max Kart01, Kart02 files with updated vehicle meshes(pedals, seat) and animations
Eagle Creek – new textures Poles
Eagle Creek – new textures for fences and poles
Eagle Creek – New fences textures
Added Glencairn and Summerton co-ord’s
BAC Mono: corrected default gear ratios for 4th, 5th and 6th to website spec
New Kart 1 and 2 exports

Build 204 (1/5/12, Manager+)
Caterham R500: fixed headlights AO, draworder issue, interior Ultra detail setting
Besos autograss files checked in
Besos texture colour correction
Leonus 68 initial gear to animation
Caterham r500 animation review + initial gear to animation
Gunmpert apollo : review changes 1PV and 3Pv driver animations
Helmetview – adapted changes from GT to Formula and KART. Disabled modern helmet geometry for CLASSIC drivers
Helmetview – top part moved lower slightly (to touch screen upper corners in 720p)
Fixed compile error in skinned bodywork carbon shader
Added new Rouen HUD map
Added Rouen Short HUD map
Fixed incorrect fresnel value on both skinned and non-skinned carbon bodywork shaders
Remove special cameras from player cycle list
UpdateTool : Used to clean out the profile during patching
Added carbon specific “paint properties” function to allow proper handling of clear-coat colour
Kart02 – Adjusted pedals, fuel tank and radiator hose to better fit driver
Kart01 – Adjusted seat size and shape, pedals and gearlever to better fit the driver
Added Rouen co-ord’s into XML for HUD maps
Heusden – new texture
New Caterham export
New Besos exports
New Heusden

Build 203 (30/4/12, Senior Manager)
Remove code to mess with AI throttle on high speed ovals
Stockcar 90: animation pack2(steering 360, gear)
Ariel Atom,Mugen: added gear to animation
Asano x4: gear to, initial animation
Tweaked and tested California Highway Hud maps
Added California track map co-ord’s into XML
Caterham R500 – Added damage deformation
BAC MONO: livery03.Initial check in
BAC MONO: new black + orange burnt stripe rim.Initial check in
BAC MONO: new black + orange burnt striped wheel.Initial check in
Besos racelines checked in
Belgian Forest – add new textures
MainMenu News Ticker updated, Version Number now present
Tweaked textures for Azure HUD maps
BAC Mono: Fixed HUD RPM range
Eagle Creek Speedway checked in
New Caterham R500 export
New Besos exports
[/toggle]

The new build is available for download on the WMD Downloads Page, new members can register here. Since this is a Junior build, all these improvements can be experienced for a one-time price of 10€.

Aside from monthly development builds like this one, Junior members also receive full access to the busy WMD forums where they can follow the development of Project CARS, talk to the developers and help shape the title as it progresses.

For more info on pricing and benefits of membership, check out the WMD website.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=506411491 マリオ クリストファ

    I’m on it!!!!!

  • Brandon Miller

    P.Cars brings the goods. It’s like every week is Christmas!

    [Edited by moderator] – We can do without the language Brandon.

    • Tomasz Zabłocki

      Yeah !!! :D:D:D 7 hours till it finishes downloading… that’s bad 😐

      • Anonymous

        Wasn’t there a patch function since last weeks build to prevent downloading everything over and over with every new build?

      • Anonymous

        The monthly Junior build is still a full download, the following three Team Member builds are available as patches then.

      • Anonymous

         Ah ok, thanks.

    • Brandon Miller

      Sorry about that, I think I was drinking. o_O

  • Ricoo

    Crazy fast car. 🙂

  • Eric Zehnder

    I like the addition of any cool car like this but it’s not that fun to drive. This car is so fast in real life that it doesn’t seem realistic when you drive it in game. But the times match up in Shift, GT5, Forza, etc. It’s just crazy to think the Zonda R can get around the ‘Ring in 6:47:50!!

    Edit: Hoping they release the Formula Ford soon and announce a few GT cars that we know are coming. I predict Ferrari (maybe) or Porsche/RUF (much more likely).

    • Tomasz Zabłocki

      Isn’t Radicall SR8 RL counterpart of pCars Racer V8 ? it was only a tenth of a second slower around the Ring then Zonda R (6:48.0X)

  • Anonymous

    Value for money, top game, gets better every week [bought rfactor 2 and hardly play it !

    • Anonymous

      Same here. I heard about the refund button in rF2 but it seems I left it too long as the refund was refused. With pCARS and  iRacing, then Assetto Corsa on the way I cannot summon the interest to go back to rF2. It feels nice and all but the half arsed mods have already compromised and diluted it’s quality for me and it seems there will be exactly the same frustrations as with rF so many years ago. 

    • http://twitter.com/zudthespud zudthespud

      rFactor 2 is just missing content, pCars is great because there’s something new every week, and the quality just keeps increasing.

      When WSGT 2 comes out though, :O

  • http://twitter.com/Polyphonie Mike

    The airconditioning vent on the Zonda R does not shake like that.  If it does it means Horacio Pagani (and his team) is a bad engineer and I truly don’t believe he is.  Look at the video of Zonda R record run at Nordschleife- the whole front panel is incredibly solid.  It’s one of the selling point of any Zonda- it’s over built to perfection.

    • Anonymous

       Well that’s that then.  It’s arcade 🙂 

      • Anonymous

         Gulyas, I notice you ‘liked’ my post but have you ever heard of sarcasm ?

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        Öööö, you are a blind guy if you deify this game all the time …
        OR you can not drive OR you drive by keyboard …
        You have to feel the BAD movements of the cars in pCARS !!!

    • Anonymous

      It’s worth noting that in my installation, the vents don’t move around much if at all.  A lot has to do with the specific settings in use.  I’m not entirely sure whether either has an effect on it, but my World Movement is set to 15, G-Force Effect at 50.

    • Niksounds B

       Man,
      here i’m not saying that you are right or not.
      I say only.. in this world there’s also the marketing.
      in all ways, we think it.

  • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

    Shift 3 … nothing more … unfortunately

    • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

       Go away

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        I don’t go away … my opinion is also an opinion.
        I just wanna open people eyes this is not a sim … so don’t buy if you want to invest in a sim !!!

    • Rolands Svetins

      This ”
      Should have been sim physics from the first Build, but it has not that … never gonna be” is a good argument!
      +1

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003712360365 Lachlan Salter

        so what u are saying is that they should NOT have let the community have their input until they have sorted out there physics, by that logic heck why let the public have input at all!! it’ll be faulty in one way or another until release and that is why it HASN’T been released.
        -1

      • Anonymous

        You have no idea what you’re talking about and it’s clear you have no idea about game development.

    • B V

       Listen, you are a very strange being. I know it and you know it. And I admit I really pity you for a protozoa being more intelligent than you. I can’t imagine how often you are going to repeat yourself. You don’t like pCARS…fine, accept it, be happy now.
      Don’t talk about simulation anymore. You don’t even know what this term means. As soon as you compare Shift and pCARS physics being equal you disqualify yourself a serious discussion partner.

      Go play whatever fits you best, enjoy doing it and stop annoying other people by sounding like a broken record. Maybe then you start evolving into a sensible human being taken serious.  

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

         Listen, I just wanna save people and his money to buy this AS A SIM, because it’s not that !!!
        I bought it, because I hoped, it’s a sim or gonna be a sim, but never gonna be…
        That is the reason why I posting here again and again.
        But if someone wants a patched Shift2 just buy it …

      • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

         Please tell me, how do you know what pCARS is going to feel like when it comes out next year?

        You’re always so certain that it’s never going to be a sim, where’s your crystal ball?

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        I don’t know gonna be a real sim or not BUT how they developed since October I supposed to be not. They improved everything exept handling system. The car movement in straight’s are ok but in bends are unrealistic ( you can not absolv a bend in one arc because the car is suddenly slipping out and back, slipping out and back … ) TO ME.
        In 2005, when I bought rF1 immediately knew, this is SIM, because of the car movements …
        Vainly you have nice graphics, good car sounds, great tracks if the handling system is a big ****.

      • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

         And why did it take 400 comments of trolling from you before you could actually make a post like this where you give arguments about why you feel pCars isn’t a sim?

        Was it that hard?

      • B V

        Like Dylan said this is your first reasonable post, Gulyás. You wouldn’t have been banned from WMD when you presented your point of view like that. You know, it’s not what you say but how you say what makes the difference.

        I think many critics of pCARS make one mistake, still. They compare it too much to fully developed games that even had several additional patch cycles. I mean it’s humanly to do so but from a technical point of view it’s unfair to knock it and won’t help.

        Each one who has bought into this project is not there to just play the title. Your bought into it to actually develop the game with the SMS team. They can’t use infos like “pCARS is shit”.

        Gulyás, imagine you wrote some code and want external people to test it and all you get from them is “the code is shit, it will never be good”. What do you think are you supposed to do then? How do you change the code into something better without knowing why the people said it’s shit? I think you get the bigger picture.

        And I guess what you can learn for yourself from your last posting…be civil and reasonable and people treat you equally.

      • Big Ron

         You shoukld compare actual builds with the first one to see that physics have improved a lot.

      • Rolands Svetins
      • Big Ron

        Dude, you have no rights to play the holy messenger to “save others” money. Are you gone mad? Every person has the right to decide by his own what game he wants to buy or not and what kind of game he likes to play. Telling that pCARS isn´t worth it´s money is anyway hard on the border of damage to reputation.

    • Ricoo

       If you can’t develop precisely why it’s not a sim maybe you should better shut up.

      • Anonymous

         ..and even if he did, who is he going to convince ??  People have their own opinions.    He’s changing no-one’s minds unless their very weak-minded.  

        This guy has a chip on his shoulder and if he thinks he’s going to use VirtualR as a place to vent his hate then he is very much mistaken.

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        I know why is not a SIM …
        It’s very very simple : the movements of the cars is not realistic at all  !!!!!!!
        I drive with G27 and I waited for the good improvements but “nothing” happened ( concerning physics ) …

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

      Gulyas is a child, nothing more.

      Should have been an adult from the start, but is not that … never gonna be
      And if someone still believe he gonna be an adult that is small baby boy … seriously

      🙂

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

         🙂

      • Anonymous

         OMG, I’ve been reading this thread/website for a long time now and just have to say that the racing community is such a whining bunch of *****.  Can you not just accept what is on the table and stop bitching about sim/arcade etc.  Montoya and F1 Racer are giving you a free service with all the up to date news on whats happening in what we are all interested in – if you like it then that’s great, if you don’t then move on but for god’s sake guys just get a life and enjoy or not what is coming to you be it RF2 or CARS or whatever.  There is so much bitching here it’s ridiculous.  Can you not appreciate that these guys spend a lot of their spare time putting information that is relevant to you in one place, you then pick what is relevant to you and find interesting or not.  I feel ashamed that the racing community is mainly made up of a bunch of people that think that making a ‘sim’ car is easy and don’t appreciate the mathematics behind making a computer replicate how a real car reacts on the road.  Most of the companies making these simulations have some very intelligent people working for them but to simulate an actual car on a home computer is very very difficult and some of you just assume this is an executive decision to go arcade rather than invest the time in making it feel right – it will never feel right because we are not sat in a car on a track, we are sat in a room on a rig!!!

        I think Virtual R is a great website which is on my homepage and i visit daily.  I don’t find it biased towards any particular sim, it just gives me the information i need.  I just think that some peeps around here need to realise that you are here for a very short time (life), start enjoying your life and stop bitching at the people that are doing you a damn good service.

        Looking forward to being totally slagged off, but then i don’t expect anything less to be honest.

      • Anonymous

         p.s my reply is in general to the whole thread, not just D, i just replied…

    • Anonymous

      Your profile picture shows a grown up man, but reading your comments, you seem te be a little schoolboy. Secretly using your dad’s account aren’t you 😉

      OT: I own GT5 as well and after testing some recent builds of pCars I think it is very convincing and believable. Much has to be done still to make it even better, but even at the current state I feel it offers a better driving experience than GT5. Which I also think has some very good sim characteristics (at least for some cars).

    • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

      You can moderate me, I don’t care but I say anyway : the main point is missing from this game, the movement of the cars is unrealistic, the speed sensation is tragically bad, etc … the other things are OK but ….

  • Anonymous

    The Pagani partnership is great news, same that the Zonda has been added. Judging from the detail and feel, they must’ve been at it quite a while before the announcement was made, with further improvements down the road as always. Now we need some more ‘common’ cars (they’re working on it, as I understand).

    • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

      True, I’ve only done one stint of the california highway, and it felt good, just need a couple of supercars to rival it so we can have a nice field with the zonda, gumpert and perhaps some koenigsegg, GTR3s, SLRs or R8s.

  • http://twitter.com/Jepsertti Jepsertti

    I like this simulator. Good feeling on steering, and nice graphics. So what’s wrong with it then? It’s handling just looks bad on videos, but when you get to real game, it’s just really good to drive. But that’s my opinion. Don’t know why everybody say it’s arcade. It’s pure sim, and handles better than rFactor, RACE or LFS for me. And just to remember, it’s finished in 2013… 

    • Niksounds B

       it’s pure sim or is it your opinion?

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Gonzalo-Rodriguez-Sastre/100001541060342 Gonzalo Rodriguez Sastre

         what you write is a question? , A rhetorical question? , metaphysical question?

    • Anonymous

      Its not arcade in the way burnout is arcade but its arcade in the sense that its closer to NFS or Forza 4 than it is to , NKP , i racing , RF2. 

      The simulation totally falls down when the car loses grip or slip angles are introduced and that’s why people call it arcade because at this point in time the simulation is lacking in fundamental areas.  

      SMS have said they are going to change the tire model and other aspects of the physics but until they do , pCars in its current form is not a very full or realistic simulation of race cars.I’m optimistic that by the end of beta or in 3-5 months time we will have a new tire model and that’s when we will know if it will make a good simulator as well as a good game.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

        I still disagree, I gave up on NKP cos I hated the handling, I persevered until a couple of years ago with LFS, and again gave up largely because I felt I was always driving on a knife edge and the tire model seemed to offer less grip that my road tyres, let alone slicks. rFActor wasn’t much better at low speeds, but more enjoyable, and obviously due the volume of mods and tracks was the more attractive option.
        Apart from some low speed issues, I find pcars very predictable, apart from some tanks slappers  which can be odd, but I guess they will be fixed, but then, driven properly, I shouldn’t be getting tank slappers, they are generally a result of my own eagerness.

      • Anonymous

        The pCar devs have said on the forum that NKP has one of the best tire models and that’s what they are shooting for with the new model they are implementing. 

        The low speed issues you are having are to do with the fact that Pcars has awfull tire simulation as it is,  if you spin up the wheels or are in any situation where the tires are skidding the simulation falls apart. 

        In a real car like say a palmer jag you can put your foot down spin up the wheels or totally rag it around the track in the wet and keep the car under control using steering along. 

      • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

        Which makes me think it is more of a suspension issue than tire model, but I’m no expert so I’ll leave it to the coders. But, as people keep making comparisons to Shift2, the biggest failing in that game was the suspension, and I fear that is also a short fall, albeit to a lesser extent, or less dramatic, in pcars. Coping with changes of direction and undulation in the surface are where the cars suffers, like downforce is non existent when the road pushes back and too much pitch on cars with little suspension travel, I’d hate to think what it will be like when rain is introduced.
        But again, early days yet, and if this game is getting 1% better each week, we should be close to perfect Summer of 2013.

    • Anonymous

       you joking? you do not know about good sim. And graphic in game looks not good.

  • http://www.facebook.com/fernando.mattos Fernando Mattos

    This simulator is SPECTACULAR! 

    • Anonymous

      Simulator? hyhyyhyy

      • B V

        Question: What would you’ve considered iRacing to be, if the former Papyrus team had gone the same way like SMS and let you have a look at the very beginning of the project?

        Don’t bother replying…it was just rethorical.

      • Anonymous

        You can often see early on in a project if a game will be more arcade than simulation. 

        As it is project cars is around the NFS Forza level of simulation it lacks the depth of the physics models found in i racing , NKP , LFS , RF2  Sure SMS might change the tire model and physics as they have said they will do but you can only evaluate software in its current state as there is no way to know what the end game will be. 

        SMS as a developer (more recently especially) tend to make games that are in the console simulator arena , so its only fair to think it likely that pCars might end up not having the deepest or consistent tire models compared to NKP, RF2, iracing.  Add to that the fact that the physics at this point in time are still derived and have many similar aspects to NFS ( especially in how cars handle when tires are slipping)

        So to answer your rhetorical question , With papyrus It is very likely that you could have seen from build 1 of i racing that it followed on from the tire model and physics of the nascar games and that code base I played the first public build and from the get go it had the same sorts of characteristics and nuances.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

        I have to disagree, I did a race last night in the GTL mod for Race 07 and I find the tire slip model in that, as with rFactor also lacking, almost to the same degree as Pcars. The low speed physics in all Gmotor2 games are odd, taking 40mph bends/chicanes are quite tough, yet I know in real life with road tires all my road cars would handle the corners better, would I consider them to be non-sim games? heck no.
        The same applies in higher speed tyre slip, it seems getting the slip angle is a very tough thing to do, in all games, in fact, in that regard, sometimes, arcade racers are closer to reality IMO. I’ve done laps, albeit in a 4WD Alfa 155 touring car replica, and the grip was phenomenal, nothing yet in any game comes close to that.
        However, so far, Pcars is very impressive, sim like, unloaded wheels locking up, losing traction on bumpy surfaces, spinning when I am over zealous with the throttle, much like I get from Simbin or rFactor, not like I get in Forza or any other console arcade racer. 
        Shift2 was flawed, not doubt about it, but we are all hoping and expecting that is their chance for redemption, they were under the influence of EA for that one, not only on the market, i.e. more arcade than sim, but also time constraints. With this project they identified a market themselves, they don’t have the pressures over an arcade publisher and are free to develop the sim as they see fit or are steered by the investors. 
        If you have issues and suggestions, go on the WMD forums, suggest how they can fix it, if you are a physics guru, go on and help out, allow them to be the only sim maker that has a proper physics and tire model with real life slip model, cos at the moment, no game is perfect in that regard.

      • Anonymous

        They know what’s wrong with the physics there coders are working on it its a fact that the tire model as it is , is awful and goes crazy when the cars start to lose grip.

        The only thing the physics have going for them right now at this point in time is that there is more grip before you lose grip but all the dynamics around how the cars move or lose grip and recover grip or pivit on there tires is fundamentaly  unrealistic. 

        Rf2 , I racing , NKP might suffer from a lack of gneral frip compared to real life and pCars but the overall dynamics of the cars though all situations is more realistic.

        I’m really hoping that SMS deliver with the new tire model if they do it will be bloody good to have a proper AAA sim game with graphics decent multi player integration  and everything else that comes with higher budget productions. 

        Obviously its early days with the pCars , I’m not bias to any of the sims I own all of them and enjoy each of them for different reasons I will probably buy pcars regardless as I am already involved with the beta and I would love to see pcars be a big success so long as it has enough depth and consistency to its tire model that it doesn’t end up like F12010-11 , NFSS or any of those games. 

      • Tiago Lapa

        These days, tire models are overrated.

        Physics simulation goes beyond tire model, although that’s a really important and difficult task alone to program one.

        They have to properly simulate suspensions and car body inertia. And much more.

        In the end, the sum of the parts make the simulation.

      • B V

        >You can often see early on in a project if a game will be more arcade than simulation.
        Correct, to some degree though.

        >As it is project cars is around the NFS Forza level of simulation it
        lacks the depth of the >physics models found in i racing , NKP , LFS ,
        RF2
        pCARS was on the Shift, Forza level with the first builds in October-December timeframe. I’ll give you that. Since then so many things have changed (not speaking of gfx) that even the most intense critic have to acknowledge that Shift, Forza can’t be even remotely compared to pCARS. Fire up Shift 2 and to better compare it take the Zonda out on Road America and the Zonda R on the same track in pCARS. You are not seriously telling me they are on the same level while being objective. Otherwise I seem to be in a coma.

        >SMS as a developer (more recently especially) tend to make games that
        are in the console >simulator arena , so its only fair to think it likely
        that pCars might end up not having the >deepest or consistent tire
        models compared to NKP, RF2, iracing.
        I know what you mean and I can completely understand this view but the people who created GTR, GTR2, GT Legends (all titles pretty much considered “hardcore sim” by the audience) are the same guys now working at SMS. And I bet you don’t forget to do serious sim coding stuff when you did it over and over again in the past.
        The Shift franchise being more “arcadish” was probably more an EA influence thing since a big publisher wants to see big $$. Why do you think did SMS cut ties with EA. Surely not because pCARS couldn’t have catered for the same Shift audience. 

        >So to answer your rhetorical question , With papyrus It is very likely
        that you could have seen >from build 1 of i racing that it followed on
        from the tire model and physics of the nascar games…
        Exactly…for the Nascar part of iRacing. But the road part I beg to differ. I’d make the bold claim that oval racing in iRacing is much better simulated than road racing. There are lots of inaccuracies ( e.g. cars doing rocket jumps into the air going over a curb) and in general the cars’ handling is too difficult in many ways. Real race drivers said that, iRacing sim racers like Greger Huttu said that. Do I say that iRacing isn’t a sim now because of that? Hardly.

        I do get though that you are more in a neutral position an waiting how things shape up. That’s pretty fine by me.  

      • Anonymous

         FFS enough of this antagonism !

        Fernando you knew that was a loaded post in this climate.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_HEJQFMZIIWS55MFDYTKUR2F5KI Firefox

    Guys please keep the “Is it a simulator? NO!” comments away, it’s getting really tiresome now…

    • Anonymous

       Don’t worry, this repetitive nonsense ends here.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_6D2OBFNYYU7KMO5XWNTWYBB5DY Tony

        Yeah you just bann everyone, because you’re on SMS payroll, this is so stupid, peolpe cant say anything with out you flipping, You are the biggest Numbskull you and Montoya and co. And Ian Bell is King of the numbskulls hahaha.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/XASO2QWJJKNKQLGY6U6WJOFARY Ted

        Shut up. And leave.

      • Anonymous

        No one has been banned Tony, and this isn’t abour pCARS, it’s about 2 peoples conduct who happen to be on the pCARS threads.
        The fact you think I’m on the SMS payroll shows how ignorant you are.  I’m simply moderating this forum and that means keeping it clean and civil.
        Right now I’m only having problems with 2 people because they can’t seem to post in a civil manner.   Everyone else is managing.   Well… until you showed up and made those two look like college professors.

        But you seem to be trying to force my hand with your last two posts just so you can help your argument.      Well if I was anything like you think I am your posts and all below them would be gone !    Yet, there they are.   

        Well I say good luck to you in your website.  I wish you well.    If you need any help with the English parts of the site, give me a call, I`ll be glad to help.

    • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

       You are ridiculous ! This is just a main point of this forum : to decided this game is a sim or just a good arcade !!! I vote for good arcade !

      • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

         Burnout is good arcade. Project CARS is a semisim.

  • http://twitter.com/WesleySmalls Wesley M

    Just wanted to buy it, great that I do not have a credit card…

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_6D2OBFNYYU7KMO5XWNTWYBB5DY Tony

      Do yourself a favour and buy netkar lol….

    • Anonymous

       Yeah, developing an opinion of your own might be a scary new experience!

      • http://twitter.com/WesleySmalls Wesley M

        dafuq? I say I cant buy it because I do not have a credit card, in what way is that even close to an opinion? 

      • Anonymous

         Maybe…maybe, I misunderstood. But to me your post implied that “thank god I didn’t waste my money on this game,” in which you would develop your own opinion of it. I didn’t mean your actual post was an opinion, rather that you are taking heart in what some here say about the game instead of trying it for yourself. That’s all.

      • http://twitter.com/WesleySmalls Wesley M

        Ah now I understand it. The ‘Great’ part was sarcastic, since I wasnt actually happy that I di not own a credit card at the moment. Due to that I am unable to buy it.

      • Anonymous

         So credit card is the only option Wesley ?   No Paypal option ?

      • Anonymous

         My bad. Didn’t mean to be so over the top. Simple misunderstanding.

      • Anonymous

         Thats the problem i can see with the project cars thread here, you get attacked by packs of wolfs, if they “think” you are talking about their beloved investment, look at the comments below, SMS are the only ones that can convince me to purchase pcars, not the community, or someone that has invested in it. 

  • tgn motorsports

    Please be careful playing pcars,

    you can be injured by it’s realism.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_6D2OBFNYYU7KMO5XWNTWYBB5DY Tony

    BTW Guys I’m starting my own web site partly dedicated to exposing Virtualr and SMS it will have a free forum so anyone can voice there opinions without censorship, I dont know what to call it yet but it will be along the lines of Unbiased sim racing. Everyone welcome. 

    • Anonymous

      I have to agree, the moderation here (F1Racer_RR) seems to be VERY heavily biased. Also, pCars really does seem just to be a Shift 3 in disquise. Having said that, I guess this comment will be censored soon aswell.

      • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

         “seems”, “seems”.

      • Anonymous

         Yes, I have. If you have any basic understanding of how physics and car dynamics work, you will quickly realize pCars isn’t a very realistic sim.

      • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

        I am aware that it isn’t at the level of rFactor and Netkar at this moment, but it does not feel like a Shift game.

        There are no IP’s on PC like GT and Forza on PC, so if pCARS fills that void it’s already good enough for me. I’ll see where it goes from with the new tire model.

      • Anonymous

         If you have any basic understanding of how physics and car dynanics work you will quickly realise that no sim is realistic.

      • Anonymous

         I don’t agree at all. Sims with proper feedback and physics (LFS, iRacing, RBR, NKP for example) helped me tremendously with training during my motorsport career, especially when I was injured and couldn’t drive our real car at events. The thing is, people who never drive a car on its very limits in real life can not comprehend how that should feel like, and those are the same people who are running around praising titles that offer no realistic physics or feedback.

        Of course one must remember that even the best racing sims are no match for the real thing, after all you are missing one the most important type of feedback there is; g-forces or the “butt feeling” of the car. Even so, proper force feedback (which I count to be one of pCars strongest weaknesses) can substitute for the lack of g-forces.

        Anyway, I suppose I’m done with this website when its own moderator goes about saying that no simulator is realistic. Pity, this place used to be great, but its rising popularity has become its own demise. So long, and thanks for all the fish! 🙂

      • Anonymous

        This is why i called for moderation of the moderating here, because it’s now creating a lot more trouble than being lenient.

        This thread is very bad, and it might be because the pro pCARS people essentially want the pCARS skeptics to shut the f up, and both sides have noticed the attitude of the staff here is kind of on the side of the pro pCARS guys. So the pro guys are exploiting this, crying everytime a negative comment comes up that doesn’t come with 78 sources, while the skeptics get pissed off at it = I’m staying out of the comments section for a while to avoid the war that’s inevitably looming 🙂

      • Anonymous

        You called for ?  If you don’t like my moderating, take it to the admin.   I`ll put my hands up if I’m wrong on this and I`ll gladly step down if I think I am bringing the site into disrepute.
        But I don’t think I am.  I am defending it against those that want to try by just trolling.
        Tell me why that’s a bad thing.
        If I didn’t, people would wonder what the hell I’m even doing if I’m just going to sit back and let it all happen.

        As far as I’m concerned, my only issue is with the trolls. Not people who don’t like pCARS.
        Many people have posted here speaking of their dislike for pCARS but they’ve done so in a normal way so there are no issues and no fear whatsoever of a moderator having to step in.

        Whenever people can’t control themselves when they post and I step in, there are always cries against it and calling me out as a moderator.  Same crap, different day.

        No personal insults, no hard profanity, no trolling or flame-baiting and basically keep it civil.

        Thats it really.  Stick to that and you won’t see as anything other than another member.
        If people are not being civil I feel it is my role to step in if things are below the belt.

        As it is now, those people now feel they want to test things and see what happens.

        I’m think the pCARS skeptics (I see we’ve changed that from ‘haters’) also want the pro-pCARS people to stfu also.
        I don’t call myself pro pCARS either.   Read my responses to Timpie.

        I’m done explaining myself to you now.

      • Anonymous

        You’re done with the website because I said no simulator is realistic ?  LOL, really ??
        Oh please cut out the drama queen stuff.   I did appreciate the Hitchhikers Guide quote though 🙂

        Well if you’re that sensitive to a simple comment like that then imagine how others feel putting up with the trolls.

        What I said was a bit tongue in cheek.   You can’t die driving a sim (well unless you have a heart attack trying to take Eau Rouge flat in the wet).    You don’t get the g-forces sitting on a chair at home and if you crash you can just hit the reset button.

        Of course each sim has it’s own degree of accuracy and while it may help in real life driving, it certainly isn’t a patch on the real thing.

      • Anonymous

        I love it when people post their opinions as fact.

        Maybe if you spent a bit more time setting the sim and your wheel up you’d think differently, but probably not.

        Regardless, thanks for your donation to the cause. Your membership helped fund the development of a sim I enjoy.

      • Anonymous

        I’m biased against trolling, thats all. 

        If certain people could post without trolling, insulting or trying to start a flame war then I wouldn’t need to moderate at all.  I could just get on and chat with you guys as normal.

      • http://twitter.com/timpiie Timpie Claessens

         No offense but you are seriously biased. Saying the “OMG this game is awesome” is no problem for you but come in and say “omg this arcade game sucks” is trolling in your eyes.
        Great moderating :/

      • Anonymous

        Yes as I’ve said,  I am biased against trolling.  

        Don’t you think that “omg this arcade game sucks” is not only the scrawlings of a 5 year old but it is flamebaiting.  You’re almost inviting people to argue with you and you know they will.
        People are going to react to a comment like that and an argument will ensue that most people are simply tired of reading time after time.
        Seriously if “omg this arcade game sucks” is the best comment you can make, then maybe you need to be picking more junior forums or social hangouts.

        Saying the game is awesome isn’t trolling.  How can you criticise someone for expressing their happiness ?

        Know one thing, if people trolled in the rF2 threads like they do here, I would be reacting just the same.    You can believe what you wish.

      • http://twitter.com/timpiie Timpie Claessens

        But…. you don’t make any sense…
        “How can you criticise someone for expressing their happiness ?
        Are you saying that people shouldn’t say that they like a game in case it pisses someone off ?”
        How can you crtitice someone for expressing their unhappeness? Isn’t that exactly the same thing? They can’t say anything bad because it might piss someone off.

        See how you are completely biased, it’s the same thing but you only want to see the good side.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

        Saying ‘it’s arcade’ or ‘it’ll never be a sim’ isn’t the same thing, that’s trolling.  Saying ‘I don’t like it’ or ‘I don’t enjoy it’ is fine, it’s honest opinion.  If someone can’t tell the difference between how those things come across then maybe they’re just an unintential troll and should learn how to word things better…

      • Anonymous

         Are there such things as unintentional trolls ? 🙂    Maybe I count as that in some peoples eyes, hehe.    Those being the usual suspect who ‘like’ all the trolls posts. 

        It seems there are trolls, wannabe trolls and those who just like to  ‘like’ the trolls posts.  Thankfully its a handful of the same people so  there’s hope for humanity yet 🙂 

      • Anonymous

        Apologies Timpie,  I think I edited my post as you were replying.   Maybe you want to re-read it.

        I don’t think you understood my post despite reading it.
        Now it seems you are just trying to twist things to support your argument.

        No, I’m saying express your unhappiness by all means.  Just be civil about it.    

        What’s so difficult to understand ?

        But OK, iIf you must know, I’m NOT happy with pCARS either.
        Are you really that surprised ?

        Visually it’s amazing, but no,  I don’t think the physics are all that.  (I hate the GUI too)  There is some truth to what pcarsphyxexpert has been saying.  
        Some of the cars are too easy to drive, some have unexplainable understeer in certain corners, and yes there is definately a disconnect feeling when you drive.  Most of that is the physics and I think some of it is my controller and maybe my settings.  But either way I know SMS is capable of better than it is right now.
        I do however think (hope) it will improve over time as it is in pre-alpha state with another year to go in its development and another tyre model on the way and improvements in every build which IS getting better each time. 
        So I’m willing to wait it out instead of hating on it.   I understand what a W.I.P. is.

        But I seem to have managed to not only say I’m unhappy with pCARS current state of physics but I’ve given my reasons why in a non-provocative and non-trolling way.  
        Wasn’t so hard to do that either.

        So you see I’m not biased to pCARS.  I won’t argue with people who are unhappy with it.
        Just those that can’t be unhappy without being a troll at the same time.

      • http://twitter.com/timpiie Timpie Claessens

        Thanks for the replies, don’t know about anyone else but to me, handling it this way makes you look alot better in my very humble opinion. We can see that you are a human with a opinion aswell 😀 And I think we all know that it’s still in his alpha phase and so, will massivly improve but that also means that now is the time to voice opinions. You’re right that this isn’t WMD’s forum and because of that won’t make a difference but that’s what this site is about as I said before, it is the only simracing news site and comments are a part of this, good and bad.

        And just so you know since it looks like I’m completely defending them here, I’m not really one of the haters but I still believe they also should have the right to say what they think.
        I agree that we have to civil and constructive about it, and it was mostly the later part that was sitting a bit weird with me since a simple “this is awesome” is just as unconstructive as “this sucks” 😀

        Anyway, I look at it as a sort of “competitor” to be like the GT5 for PC’s. Big car choice, pretty visuals and lots of tracks and it really is getting better by the build.
        The newly released Zonda finally got rid of the pendulum effect in the steering wheel, it feels rather death apart from aswell but atleast it drives a bit more…. natural by now 🙂

      • Anonymous

        I appreciate that Timpie, thanks.
        I’m really not as bad as some think I am. They just don’t like it when I get on their asses for trolling.   But that’s kinda my role here.

        I’m a bit unsure when you say ‘haters’ should be able to say what they think.   To me that sounds like we are letting ourselves in for hateful posts and should let that happen 🙂

        No I think if people think pCARS isn’t for them or maybe, like me, just aren’t totally happy with the way it is right now, they can express their opinion without any fear of censorship, with the proviso that they are civil about it.

        As for me, I’m optimistic that pCARS will improve in the next year.  As it is now, well, I’ve played mods in rFactor that I would say are getting beaten by pCARS even in it’s current state.  But that’s just my opinion.   
        I would like pCARS to really end up being amazing though.  Don’t we all ?    We’re all simmers at the end of the day and surely we all want a really cool pure sim with graphics like this.
        Here is our chance to have that and I think that because in some people’s opinions it’s not, so far, shaping up that way, they feel they have to vent in quite an abrupt way.

        I`ll let you know what I think of the Zonda once I get to try it in maybe a weeks time :).

      • Anonymous

         honestly, you just can’t expect everyone to do this. Some will take the time, and others will hook onto this and say “yes, that is how i feel”, but they won’t write it out like this.

        I’ve already expressed my feelings on pcars in several posts, but if 10 people say “pCARS is absolutely stunning”, i can’t help it. I will just want to say, “it’s not stunning. It’s graphics are pretty good, but it’s physics are way off.”

        Am i allowed to say this, because i didn’t really back up my claim this time? I feel i should be allowed to say this, but the way you’ve posted lately I honestly can’t tell anymore if this is an acceptable post, and that’s why I’m getting annoyed around here. So maybe I’m getting the wrong impression and things aren’t as bad as i thought, if so, let me know.

      • Anonymous

        No I don’t expect everyone to do it.  But the ones that can’t manage to be anything other than trolls can expect to be told to behave at the very least. 

        Nothing wrong with that reply in my eyes mate.    But you do recognise that it is just your opinion against theirs, right ?  Neither of you would be wrong.  

        You don’t need to ask me what you are or not allowed to write.  I think by now I have made things more than crystal clear.    When people write their posts they`ll already know if they are being hostile, trolling or aggressive.   I mean why post with the the sole intention to provoke people ?    But it seems you think that someone finding a care stunning is provocative because you might disagree.    Well if you disagree say so.
        I don’t think your example reply was particularly any of those.

        I dunno why this is such a big deal.  IMO, it’s just the haters reacting to not being allowed to hate all over the site, because that’s the only issue here.  Taking up an opposing opinion isn’t a problem whatsoever.
        It’s just normal to expect a certain level of decency on a public forum or blog.   Every forum has rules on posting behaviour.
        It is wrong for people to think they are free to post as trolling or as insulting as they want without being challenged by a moderator or admin.

      • Philip Samuelson

         My personal belief — If you intelligently support your argument, it won’t be seen as bitching. Calling a personally opinion a fact or at all fact based is a joke, it will always get you a ton of horse crap flying your direction.

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        There are not trolls JUST different opinions.
        You just can not tolerate them.
        That’s it !
        Who is baby boy ???

      • Anonymous

        You seem to be a bit confused of what trolling actually is. If someone has a strong opinion about something (such as the guy whose post you censored) he isn’t necessary trolling. He might simply have a great dislike for this title considering it promises to be a great realistic sim, and one might not find those qualities in it. Therefore, I simply find it very biased to go about removing posts from people who simply have an opinion on something they have spent their money on and didn’t get what they were expecting/promised.

      • Anonymous

        I would suggest to that guy that if he has spent money on the product and doesn’t like it then he can do one of two things.

        1)  Complain on the actual WMD forum….    oh no, he can’t, he got banned from there for some strange reason…  Hmmmm

        2)  He can express his opinion on here but be civil about it.

        I can assure you I have no confusions about what trolling actually is.  It is possible to be strongly opinionated (as I am), and still post those opinions without being insulting, offensive or childish.
        Gulyas post, which I edited, served only 1 purpose.   To inflame others, insult and generally be a troll just for the sake of it.
        Besides which, we are all aware of his particular opinion.  

        Removing posts doesn’t make me biased.    If someone posted  “This sim is awesome !  I love it so f**k all you haters” (without the asterisks),  that would also be unacceptable.

        Similarly, if Gulyas posted his opinion in a civil way and someone replied to him, hurling abuse at him,  I`d be defending Gulyas.

        Be under no illusions, my only role here as a moderator is to keep this place civil.  Beyond that, I don’t care what you say or what your opinion is.

      • Philip Samuelson

         Some people will never be satisfied until they have the world at their feet… Must be republicans lol.

      • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

        Thank you Mr Moderator ! 🙂
        I changed my mind …
        This could be a very good game IF they improving handling system in bends and speed sensation in cockpit view.
        I DON’T HATE THIS GAME !!!
        It was civil way enough ? 😀

    • pez2k .

      You might want to reconsider the ‘unbiased’ part of the name if the point of founding it is to badmouth one specific site and one specific company.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

      You can call it ‘DisgruntledTrolls-2012’ 🙂

    • http://twitter.com/Dillyracer Dylan H.

      “Attention deficit disorder Simulation racers” should do the trick.

    • Anonymous

      Great idea !  You can take the trolls off our hands.

    • Tomasz Zabłocki

      Great idea, can’t wait to express my genuine, unbiased pCARS fanboism there. I’ll do my best to share the ‘TRUTH’ in every single forum thread. Let’s hope you’ll do a good job at handling bias and censorship aspects.

    • Anonymous

      The only thing I’ve ever seen censored here is bad language and downright personal attacks. Beyond that the people who want to come here and bash the sim are allowed to freely speak their peace. However, there are enough people here that do like PCARS that the haters club has to deal with all the rebuttals. You guys comment on every PCARS thread purely to troll as your comments are more and more rarely in regard to the thread you’re posting in.

      If you’re looking for a place that you can bash this, or any other game for that matter without someone disagreeing with you then take your toys and play with yourself as you’ve implied you’re going to do. But you guys act like your word is fact when it simply is not. Regardless, thanks for once again running the comment total up on this thread. There is no such thing as bad publicity and anyone with enough balls to develop there own opinion rather than falling in line with all the sheep crying “it sucks” will be rewarded with a great gaming experience. And don’t even start in with “ah, you said gaming, not simming”, rFactor is a game, rFactor2 is a game, iRacing is a game, NKPro is a game….need I go on?

      • Philip Samuelson

         It’s like a pickup basketball game… You can call anything a foul, but you will get flack for it. You can come around here and pretty much say whatever you want, but you’re gonna take flack if you speak like a moron! 🙂

    • Anonymous

      I’d join!!!!

      • Anonymous

         No, no , you’re staying here !  🙂    Don’t turn to the dark side !  🙂

      • Anonymous

        I’m no sith….just someone who believes the truth is more important than anything, especially my truths, LOL.

      • Anonymous

        Heh, now that IS elitist 🙂

        Fair enough.

      • Philip Samuelson

         Seriously where the hell is that dislike button when you need it?

    • Anonymous

      Please make sure to let me know once that site starts, I’m looking forward to what you “expose”.

      I hate to ruin your fun but I’ve always been a 100% open about my intensions, everyone knows I work for SMS, it’s no secret…. so there really isn’t anything to expose I’m afraid 🙂

    • http://www.facebook.com/HoboHealy Joshua Healy

       The irony is killing me…

  • Anonymous

    Ah, I see the fact patrol is here again right on que.

    It amazes me people actually have time to race these days. Bashing (trolling) PCARS seems like a full time job for a lot of people.

    • Tomasz Zabłocki

      You’re just full of ignorance – it is not a job, it is a mission !!! A battle between the TRUTH and our delusions. They do it solely for our sake, for free and yet you call it a job. How much disrespect, so sad…

      Whatever tommorow brings, the Fellowship Of Gulyás (aka FOG) won’t be forgotten…I just wanted to show my gratitude and found a right tribute:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BceAvSZ-V28 

      • Anonymous

         LOL! Whatever freak.

      • Tomasz Zabłocki

        oh come on 😛 

  • http://www.facebook.com/gulyopapa Gulyás Tamás

    I completely agreed !!!

  • Anonymous

    This game is shaping up rather nicely!! Im enjoying it all except the slight amount of steering delay that is still present which makes me turn off after a few laps!!
     
    what worries me slightly is the fact that the first controller preset is for the xbox 360 controller and not a wheel which leads me to belieive that the cause of this steering lag is down to controller input filtering numbing things down, surely a real ‘sim’ would not really be playable with a pad at all but i realise they intend a console realease and need to make it playable with a pad but i think their priorities may be different to ours as ‘sim racers’.  I think the physics are showing great improvement and i’m really looking forward to the finished product and mods to start rolling out on this title!!

    • Anonymous

      As far as that Zonda goes, I’ve only got the video and peoples comments to go on. 🙁
      I’m waiting on a replacement motherboard to arrive this week before I can try it out.  

      • Philip Samuelson

         This is why I always carry backup gear!

      • Anonymous

        I’m not going to spend money on parts I might never need.  Especially motherboards that go out of date before yoghurt.
        Besides my rig is pricey.  Buying 2 of everything is bad economy.    Especially if the parts fail under warranty as mine did.
        For other parts I can just run down to the shops.

    • Anonymous

      First, have you turned GFX settings down to reduce lag?
      2nd, didn’t I spy a controller input filter on/off…

      • Anonymous

        I held out hope for you and I feel vindicated.    Respect, man ! 🙂

      • Anonymous

        Theres an on off button for control filtering is there? i will have to have a look for that later then! sounds promising! yeah i have tried turning down graphics but its still not quite where i want it, i love the responiveness i get in rfactor, iracing and gtr but pcars still feels a lil odd to me at the moment, but hey its pre alpha i will hold out before making any real judgements! it feels a lil like the car is still turning after i have straightened up the wheel particularly in corners like the craner curves at donington! (probably due to this delay or maybe i have that filtering on will check later and report back!)

        Cheers

      • http://www.facebook.com/kris.baxter2 Kris Baxter

        odd yours defaults to gamepad, in all the releases mine defaults to my G25, and all I change is linearity and sensitivity and suffer no lag. If you have a profile for gamepad and wheel is your gamepad profile listed ahead of the G25 in windows? I don’t have a gamepad so that would be why mine goes straight to wheel.

        As for F1Racer comments below about the Zonda, I’ve done a stretch on California highway and loved it, very responsive, less twitchy than the Gumpert IMO, and faster to boot, but still a handful.

      • Anonymous

        Something for me to look forward to then Kris 🙂     I can just imagine what it must be like to put it on that highway.   Gotta be a total blast.   

  • http://twitter.com/wickenex Daniel Bonito

    If I had a credit card I would join this project but I don’t 🙁

    • Philip Samuelson

       They take Paypal. If you have a bank account, create a Paypal account, link it with your bank account, and join in!

      • http://twitter.com/wickenex Daniel B.

        And what if I don’t have a bank account too?

      • http://www.facebook.com/HoboHealy Joshua Healy

         Some retailers allow you to buy a “Pre-paid debit card”. Basically it is like buying a normal gift card but you can use it online, you pay for how ever much you want on the card and it’s kind of like a one use only kind of thing. Then you pay like you would a normal credit card (I think).

        Ask around and see if you can find a place that sell them, I know a few people that have bought things online using these because they don’t trust banks or paypal.

  • Eric Zehnder

    1. The new build isn’t the greatest as they rolled out a new FFB EXE that has some good and some bad. The good is understeer and grip effects that were lacking. The bad is that braking FFB isn’t really there anymore. The overall good thing is that they know about it, acknowledged it, and know exactly how to get it back in. The feel under braking was excellent last week so I expect it to return quickly.

    2. I know there are all these claims of censorship and pCARS bias and that’s clearly not true. Can we make it true, mods? All pCARS posts become inundated with trolls. Can you please start moderating the forum by deleting posts that are clearly trolling? I would expect the same in posts about rFactor, AC, or GTR3. The only people that would leave and not come back as a result of the ACTUAL censorship aren’t wanted anyway.

    Everyone – Please stop talking like we don’t know the difference between dissenting opinions and trolling. It’s quite easy once you’re older than 13.

    • Anonymous

      Whereby anything a pcars booster doesn’t agree with amounts to trolling?

      • Anonymous

         What does it matter ?  It’s not his decision.

        Don’t worry, you’re free to have your opinions as always.   Eugene misunderstood Eric’s post completely because he certainly didn’t say it as Eugene translated it.

        There’s a big difference between having an opposing viewpoint and trolling, as I’m sure will be demonstrated in the next pCARS thread when (the same) people once again will not be able to control their little selves.  

        But because the trolls have caused this by bleating the same notes in numerous pCARS threads now, it’s only served to highlight the situation and made them more likely to be scrutinised.
        You make your bed, you lie in it.

      • Anonymous

        I’ve taken onboard what you’ve said, and I’m mindful that I don’t come across as hyper aggressive or whatever my sin is.
        Remember that I like pcars as a simcade/arcade game, but just don’t think it’s a sim, and even if some of the established sims are too hard to drive, pcars is too easy to drive and has bad FFB compared to the best sims.

      • Anonymous

         Cool. 

      • Eric Zehnder

        Yeah, change your name to your real name and quit trolling.

      • Anonymous

         Ok Eric, lets give the guy a chance.

      • Anonymous

        I completely disagree in your view of trolling though.  It seems that if anyone dares to suggest that this or that feels wrong with the game, then unless you have scientific proof with the back up of the University of Games developers, you are a troll.  Surely trolling is when someone comes on a thread and says things that are insulting and designed to cause ripples of anger?  Saying that a game feels wrong, feels different, feels arcade is a personal opinion.  It is not insulting anyone and it is not causing abuse.  Maybe another moderator would not like the way the game is going/feeling and say so too.  Would that moderator now be classed as a troll?

      • Anonymous

        Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

      • Anonymous

         Don’t post if you haven’t got anything decent to say, you’re on notice as of now 🙂

      • Anonymous

        Touché

      • Anonymous

        What does zzzzzzzzzzzzz mean F1?  Does not seem worthy of a mod to be sarcastic.  Just saying like.

      • Anonymous

        Just saying ?  You’re trying to pick a fight with me and have been for the last few posts.

        Zzzzzz in this case means you bored me with your last post because all of those comments of yours have been answered multiple times if you’d been bothered to keep up.
        I also couldn’t care less what you think is or isn’t trolling.  On that matter, your opinion is irrelevant.    Do you think you’re not trolling right now ?  Maybe Eric was right.

        Sarcasm is perfectly acceptable and I can use it as much as the next guy. 
        However having said that, you need to check up on the meaning of sarcasm because that’s not it.    Just saying like.

      • Anonymous

        Why would I pick a fight with you?  Don’t be so childish.  You hold all the power remember.  If I was to reply to your posts with “zzzzzzzz” and “you are boring me now”, how would that make you respond?  It seems ok for you to make such flippant remarks but not others and especially not anyone who negatively remarks about PCars.  I am merely someone who loves race sims (PC only) and who wanted PCars to be the sim of choice.  I don’t like the way it is going both in terms of eye candy niceness and test drive unlimited mentality.  I also don’t like the way it handles right now.  Now I can say these things, but I should not expect abuse from any member for saying so.  Any abuse should be jumped on.  Do you not agree?  I am not abusing anyone.  I am not attempting to spoil any ones party and I am not a troll despite what others try to persuade otherwise.  I am merely discussing Pcars.

      • Anonymous

         HAH !  I love it.  You say why would you pick a figiht with me and then you call me childiish.   BTW, how many people have to referred to as childish in the last 48 hours ?  Seems to be a few.

        No mate, if I make a flippant remark, and someone gets back at me for doing it, then its fine.  I can handle it.  But it wasn’t name-calling, swearing or trolling.    Your post was a repeat of things that have been said over and over already and all answered.  You’d know that if you’d read the thread.

        See again you have this delusion that people can’t make negative comments on pCARS.   Where do you ever get this idea from ?    If making negative comments on pCARS was an issue, believe me I would have come right out and said it.
        I’ve made some negative posts on pCARS myself.  A couple of which are in this very thread !

        I don’t know how it can be that you want to come across as mature and yes not be able to grasp the issue at hand here. That issue being trolling.   I don’t class negative comments as trolling.
        Put it this way…   all trolling posts are negative but not all negative posts are trolling.
        Comprendé ?     

        Why do you say ‘wanted’ pCARS to be the sim of choice ?   Have you given up on it while it’s in pre-alphs ?    Seems a few have.  I think that they think that because pCARS hasn’t yet met their high expectations, its ok to shit on and vent your wrath to these threads.    Thats different from someone posting what they are not happy with in a civil manner, don’t you think ?

        You say you’re not abusing people but you’re not averse to calling people childish.  What kind of a reaction do you think that’s gonna get ?
        If you don’t want to be jumped on then don’t write a post that makes that likely unless you can take the flak.

        But yes, I do agree,  if you post you are unhappy with the handling and you’re not trolling and someone gives you abuse for it… I`ll jump on them, don’t worry about that.

        Again, same applies in any thread here, regardless of topic.  pCARS is not exclusive to my attentions.  This just happens to be the trolls hangout right now.

        Please tell me you understand the difference between a post from someone who doesn’t like the way pCARS feels for them and a troll.     Lets put this to bed once and for all cos I’m tired of having to repeat myself for those that can’t get it into their heads !

      • Anonymous

        Eugene.

        That is one of the finest posts I’ve read in months….bravo for such a direct and concise account of the pcars debacle.

      • Anonymous

        Awww Eugene, you’ve made a lickle fwiend.  

        Ok well Im a moderatro and I’ve already said multiple times (and in a civil way) that there are things about pCARS I’m not liking atm.   Ive criticised the steering, the disconnected feel while driving, the UI, random understeer moments.
        But I didn’t troll about it.  And I’m not treating this game like its 1 week away from a final build.

        So Eugene, if you cut out your exaggerations and sarcasm, you’ll find that our views on trolling isn’t that far different.    The posts I’m complaining about ARE the ones that are insulting or designed to cause ripples of anger.   Yet you seem to have this oh so big problem with it.

        See, you’ve just seen this whole thing flare up thanks to the trolls, you like a couple of others, think that every negative post is going to be targeted.    Well you’re wrong. Need proof ?  Look around.

        I think you know the real deal here and you both just want to carry one bleating on about it.
        Seriously guys, move on.    My opinion is unchanged.   We’re all wasting time here.

      • Anonymous

        You mean the fanboys won’t be able to control there little selves or the trolls wont be able to control them selves?  It seems to me that if you dont like Pcars you are a troll but if you are a fanboy trolling (and lets face it, some of them do make comments designed to cause an argument and that is trolling) that’s OK?  Is that right or have I misunderstood you?  This is a place where all sim fans can chat, comment and generally discuss all things related good or bad.  Or did I get that wrong too?

      • Anonymous

        I already pulled up one ‘fanboy’ for attempted flamebaiting so don’t twist things.

        But to answer your question, yes, it seems you have misunderstood me.

        No you’re not wrong in the last bit.   Trolling and ‘discussing all things related good or bad’ are completely different things.   Once you see that, the clouds will clear.

      • Anonymous

        All clouds are now clear and I understand.  Anyone who wishes to make any comment on the latest build is to give praise and praise alone.  I understand. 

      • Big Ron

         Try to express yourself in a civil and constructive way and nobody will care about your direction of comments. But just saying “pCars physics is bad and it´s arcade” is just trolling since the physics are not top-noth atm, but for sure better than arcade.

      • Anonymous

        Same goes for you I suppose Big Ron.  Try to discuss things like an adult and stop resorting to name calling and things will be more constructive.

      • Anonymous

         Hey, that’s what I’ve been saying !   Nice to have you on-board.

      • Anonymous

         Fine, that`ll do. 
        If that’s as much as you can understand after all that has been said then I`ll just try and drop to your level of understanding and say yes, praise and praise alone.  Happy now ?    
        You can take that as literal because it seems to be all you can manage.
        To others who do understand, they can take that for what it is, sarcasm.

      • Anonymous

        If you say so master.

      • Anonymous

        LOL

    • Anonymous

      My god I have seen some things but takes the biscuit.  “Only positive and good things are allowed to be said………..zat is an order…..dissenters will be shot” Incredible and darn right cheeky. Maybe you should buy VR?

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

        And you’ve highlighted the problem right there.  You’ve said you don’t like rF2 much, but you (and most everyone else) don’t say ‘it feels arcade’ or ‘it’s just simcade to me.’  But for pCARS, just saying ‘I don’t like it’ isn’t enough, it’s always appended with ‘It’s too arcade’ or ‘it’ll only ever be simcade’ etc.

        See the difference there?  I dare you to say rF2 is ‘simcade’ or ‘arcade’ and see what response you get.

        Whatever.  None of these trolls here seem to get the difference so should just be ignored in future.  In fact, if the term ‘arcade’ or ‘simcade’ are mentioned it would be better if those posts were just deleted.  *Note: that still means you can say ‘I don’t like it’ or ‘it doesn’t work/feel right for me’ but just doesn’t include the stupid flamebait terms…

      • Anonymous

        But why should the terms arcade or simcade matter so much to anyone?  And what does flame bait mean?   As for daring me to say something? Isn’t that extremely childish?  Seriously I think that a lot of people here get upset way to easy.  I don’t like the term “haters” or “Trolls” but many here including moderators use those terms in a derogitory manner.  Perhaps posts like your should be ignored in the future as it serves no other purpose other than to cause arguments with all the name calling and labelling.  

        I never even heard of the term simcade before I came here but thinking about it, I’d say it is a very good and apt description of Pcars at this present build state as it neither sim nor arcade totally in my opinion.  

      • Anonymous

        Eugene, you just have to look at the words ‘haters’ and ‘trolls’ to realise that’s hardly a positive thing.  So of course it is said in a derogatory way.

        To answer your question about what is flamebait….

        Flamebait   
        1) Flame bait is a message posted to a public Internet discussion group, such as a forum, newsgroup or mailing list, with the intent of provoking an angry response (a “flame”) or argument over a topic the “troll” (original poster provoking angry response) often has no real interest in, and finds humour, or entertainment in reactions.

      • Anonymous

        WOW, I take exception to deleting posts which question the state of pcars physics.
        As a owner of many racing games, including many sims, I do find pcars to be in the arcade camp, but I certainly won’t put up a fight over the term simcade.

      • Eric Zehnder

         Yeah, see that’s a perfect example of how comments go on here. I didn’t say only positive things were allowed. In fact I said “Please stop talking like we don’t know the difference between dissenting opinions and trolling”.

        The WMD forums are filled with people trying to make the game better and there are dissenting opinions left and right and that’s a good thing. Trolling (what you’re doing) is not welcome there, here or anywhere.

        Specifically what I wrote was towards the mods asking for them to actually moderate these and all VirtualR posts for trolling comments and users. The fact that we have users on this site with names like “pcarsphyxexpert” who only come around to have fun trolling and not get banned from the site is ludicrous.

      • Anonymous

        I take offense at your insult actually and perhaps it’s your kind of post that should be moderated.  I am not a troll and never have been and despite what you say.  Just because you say it’s so does not mean it’s fact.  Heard that before?  You don’t make the rules here.  You might at WMD but not here.  Your definition of trolling is wrong so stop trying to force the issue.  I’m standing up here for the members who want to say something other than “Pcars rocks, it’s the best sim ever”.  Because as yet it isn’t and going by the direction it’s currently in, it might never be.  So hopefully the “mods” here will live and let live and not just pander to employee’s (possibly) or members of WMD and their wishes to delete posts at their will.  And no matter what a users name is, he is entitled to comment just like you.  But have you noticed how it is people like you who insult and call names in an effort to belittle people?  Their are others here I have noticed.  

        As for the game, I am hoping it will turn out better and more PC Sim orientated (anything aimed at the consoles is never going to be a sim in my opinion).  

      • Anonymous

        Mods in quotes eh ?  Am I sensing a little patronising ?

        Well just so you know, I pander to no-one!  Some assume that because this is a pCARS thread and they think SMS have taken over control of all the sim news sites.  As if !
        This could just as easily be an rFactor 2 thread. 

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

        Definitely couldn’t be an rF2 thread.  There people would just say they don’t like the handling or it doesn’t feel right, they certainly wouldn’t just say things like ‘the physics have issues, it feels arcade.’ or ‘I feel this game is just going to be a good simcade’ etc…

        The fact people think that just because it will be on consoles the physics suddenly can’t be ‘sim,’ even though the consoles are probably higher spec than many of those hardcore racers’ PCs used to run rFactor just shows how juvenile that opinion is.  I think the casual console crowd can handle realistic physics, there are assists and things to help them along the way to unassisted sim enjoyment.

      • Anonymous

        Again, another person insults by calling anyone who is not a fan boy “juvenile”.  What is it with you guys?  And to say any of the consoles are more powerful than a modern gaming rig PC is wrong also.  You have a go at the so called trolls here for stating things they cannot back up and here you are doing the same thing. Incredible.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/H3PBF7NWKJJIICFPQSXMGOAPDU D

        I think you missed what I was saying there.  I’m not talking about current PCs, I’m talking about the PCs that were used to run rFactor 1…  Anyway, I’ll leave it alone now.

      • Anonymous

         ..and people who do like pCARS don’t get insults ?   Whats with those guys ?

        Him saying consoles are more powerful than some peoples rigs may not be 100% true (I know sim-racers with pretty low spec PCs), but it isn’t something he had to back up, so it wasn’t really the same thing.

      • Anonymous

        As usual defend the fanboys.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_UD2V5C52HZDSKEABP7KGWUD5CI Cosmo

        well this was a long thread to go thru and i finally got there.  
        dude you think you’re not a troll but all youve done on here is argue with ppl!   And now you’re trying to push the buttons of the moderator. smart move and good luck!  

        is he supposed to defend the trolls then?  as I see it the ppl who get defended are those who dont deliberatey antagonize others whether they like pcars or not.  if you post well its not a problem what side your opinion is.

      • Anonymous

        OK.  Whatever mate.

      • Anonymous

        There ya go.  Your last two sentences sums it all up in a nutshell.  
        Celebrate it,  whinge about it.  Don’t matter either way, providing……… …….  (want to see if you can finish the sentence off correctly Eugene?   Theres a ‘like’ in it for ya 🙂

      • Anonymous

        pcars in pro mode with all assists off feels like ABS/TC is on{in most cars anyway}

      • Anonymous

        I don’t troll, I just tell the truth about pcars, ie, it’s not a sim as it’s a grip fest, brake mash fest and feels weird to drive over bumps as the cockpit elevates 6ft.

      • Anonymous

         It would be nice if you could reply for once without forcing the phrase ‘it’s not a sim’ into it.

        It really looks like you just want to shove it down peoples throats all the time.    Considering how much you dislike it though, it does seem like you’ve driven it an awful lot.

        Do you want pCARS to succeed and be a good sim ?  Is that why you’re mad that it doesn’t meet your expectations ?   So you’ve decided just to hate on it.

        Or do you just not want to like ever and just keep letting people know.

      • Anonymous

        I just want the freedom to speak freely.
        Not sure if I’ve told you before, but I like pcars as a arcade game, it’s the sim part that I object to.
        Also, I’ve never used direct profanity against anyone at this blog, so if anything, some people are hating on me…!

      • Anonymous

         ” I like pcars as a arcade game,”

        Rinse and repeat.  Rinse and repeat…

        You can’t surely be wondering why some negativity came in your direction after some of your posts. You must know you are setting out to push peoples buttons.  You can object if you want, but in the end it is simply your opinion, nothing more. If someone has a different opinion, it’s not obligatory to have to repeat your well worn opinion on them too. 
        You can bleat about it being arcade until your last breath but others are just as entitled to bleat about it being a sim.  And if you think you should be able to say it’s arcade without being abused for it, then so do those that think otherwise. 

        IMO, I think just saying its ‘arcade’ is a bit shallow and seems thoughtless.
        I don’t think it’s that simple. I don’t subscribe to this theory that racing games can only be put into 1 of 2 boxes.   A racing game that may not be deemed to have the best physics out there doesn’t automatically make it arcade and different people have different opinions of what does.
         
        Now I’m sure you would like to speak freely but so would others.  They’d like to offer an opposing opinion without knowing someone is going to come along and troll at them for having that opinion.   It works both ways.

        Oh and speaking freely doesn’t mean you can say anything your want. Not without consequence anyway, as you’ve found out.

        To me it’s just common sense when writing a post you will know what kind of effect it is going to have.  When a someone writes a trolling post, he know’s he’s done so.  It’s not an accident.
        Even this reptition in your posts about arcade this and that is trolling because you’re just repeating the same thing again and agian knowing that in the past it has got negative reactions from people.

      • Anonymous

        I prefer the term arcade in it’s current state, but I won’t object to someone using simcade, however, it’s so far from being a sim, that I feel arcade is the more appropriate term.
        You can go to many forums across the WWW and find people who agree with me and those that do not, but that’s the nature of this subject I guess.

        For me, I need better more detailed FFB at the very minimum for anything to qualify as a sim, and slamming the brakes on any of my sims results in HUGE simulated braking feedback, often accompanied by the car spinning as well.

      • Ricoo

        poor sim and arcade is not the same thing. Mario Kart is arcade. Arcade doesn’t try to simulate car behavior.

        pCARS clearly tries to simulate car behavior so it is absolutly not arcade. Maybe it’s not the best sim but calling it arcade is not fair and biased toward trolling.

      • Big Ron

        “the latest build for me feels very different to the first builds but in a negative way”

        I had good laugh. Completely untrustworthy comment. Did you ever compared the first and the last builds in the last time? I doubt it.

        Feel free not to like pCARS, but on´t talk that nonsense.

      • Anonymous

        Big Ron, you are perhaps one of the best trolls here because you deliberately insult people and await a response.  Why is my comment “untrustworthy”?  What a silly and childish thing to say.

      • Big Ron

        I extry made a quote to show why your post is nonsense. I am not more trolling than you do.

      • Anonymous

        But why was my comment “untrustworthy”?  And it is you who seems to be talking nonsense as you put it.

      • Big Ron

         Because saying that the latest builds feel worse than the first ones is just not possible. The first builds felt like Shift.

      • tgn motorsports

         I have to agree with ron,
         I don’t see people trolling the rf2 threads saying it has look no better then 1998 gpl  and other games.  No one does that.
        Nor do I see anyone saying how horrid it’s ui is and the set up area is laughable. Not one flame on any of those things,
        Not one person says anything like ” this rf2 game is great because I can run it on my Pentium 2.”  So I really don’t understand why all the negative comments from people that most likely never bought more then junior wmd account just to realize their 2002 pc won’t run the pcars at more then 5fps because in 2003 it ran rfactor great in cartoon land.

    • Marco Conti

      I don’t know if I would go as far as censorship, although I do know the difference between criticism and trolling, but it would be nice if Disqus had a comment system similar to youtube, where bad posts get voted down and collapsed. At that point the community is in charge and not one person has to take on the burden of censorship.

      I am actually surprised Disqus is not already offering this feature. 

      • Anonymous

         That would be a nice feature indeed.

  • Refik Baykal

     I’m a drama queen, therefore i like pCars topics! 140 comments about a monthly build? I can’t imagine what will go down when finally this title gets released.

  • Anonymous

    I think some of the negativity would disappear if people who do have negative thoughts about PCARS would keep their posts relative to whatever the news in the thread is. If it’s a build update, please-drive the build before you comment and be specific about what you do or don’t like. If it’s something like an announcement of an upcoming car like when they announced the partnership with Mitsubishi, share your 2 cents on the car, what it may mean to the sim or what the car means to you, and move on. If you come into a thread of screenshots and start posting negativity towards the game, then you are bringing the negativity in all by yourself and therefore open yourself up to whatever may be said.

    It’s a well known fact that there is a group of people that don’t like PCARS, SMS, or even the people that do like it/them. However, the people that do like PCARS aren’t the ones coming into these threads with the intent of negativity.

    I can respect anyone’s opinion and either agree, or disagree with it at the same time as long as there is some effort to provide logic and reason. I don’t even have to share in your logic as long as you provide any kind of specific reason why you don’t like-in this instance-PCARS. All I ask is for the same in return.

  • Anonymous

    just drove the latest build (the f1 car at spa, and the go kart, have got zero interest in other cars). no setup changes, just calibrated the steering under controls.

    – the car doesn’t have steering lag input anymore, which is a step in the right direction.
    – ffb is still pretty useless and doesnt convey any information.
    – the car is more responsive and physics dont seem as canned
    – it is still no where near rfactor 1 for driving realism, let alone rfactor 2. 
    – oversteer still feels unnatural, and when it happens, theres no ffb to communicate it. it still feels like the car is rotating ‘on the spot’ like f1 2011. 
    – understeer is plain odd – if you enter the corner too hot, and scrub the speed off, the car pulls back into the corner in ‘steps’, as if you have to get back to a calculated speed in order for the car to not understeer. 
    – the car reacts badly to bumps and kerbs still, and the car starts bouncing – this isn’t more evident than if you drive the go kart, where once you start bouncing it doesnt stop. 

    – lovely hand movement details
    – wont comment on graphics coz its pre alpha
    – sounds for the f1 car are terrible

    – on my 3rd lap i drove a 1.50.5. my very next lap was 2 thousanths quicker. thats how easy the game was to adjust to – its still pretty bland and uninvolving to drive.

    so conclusion – doesnt hold a candle to rfactor 1 yet. its way way better than nfs shift 2, its nothing like that to drive. its much closer to a sim, but the car just doesnt feel connected to the road yet. If it can get to rfactor 1 standards of realism/ffb + the amazing graphics, and focused on multiplayer, id be very happy.

    • Anonymous

      Excellent feedback there.  I wish I could put it down in good words like you.  Well done.  You describe exactly how I see it at the moment.  Hopefully it will improve.  Regarding Shift 2.  I quite like that now I use the Community Mod.  It improves it no end.  One of the reasons I was hoping that Pcars would allow for mods but I think they are going to put a stopper on that one at WMD.

      • Anonymous

        I’m thinking pcars is more of a community assisted profit maximizing scheme than race sim, so I suspect modding will be out so that DLC has the best chance of drawing extra profit.
        I could be wrong of course, but there was a bit of a tiff over modding/modders at one point……which seems outright crazy for a “community assisted” project, but I’ll let you join the dots…

    • Anonymous

      Great post indeed. I don’t know that I could pin down any particular nuances and point them out the way you have. That’s the kind of post I’d love to see more of over at the SMS forums.

      I would suggest giving the Jaguar JPLM a go around Besos. IMO it has the best feedback at this point and the track has modeled bumps in it which most do not at this point. Also, something I found is that if you go into the F1 menu while driving and simply amplify some of the FFB effects via the F1 menu, the FFB improves a bit. I agree, it’s still not on par with rFactor, but it is inching closer to feeling great IMO.

    • Anonymous

      See it can be done 🙂

      I’m not sure about your claim about it being uninvolving because you got 2 close laptimes.
      Ive had races in RACE07 and rFactor and looking at my laptimes at the end I’ve had less than a second between my slowest and fastest laptime. One time in an F1 race I had around 0.5s between the slowest and fastest. That’s how it should be I think.
      I don’t think inconsistent laptimes would be a great selling point. 

      I can agree with most of the rest of your post though, particularly about the oversteer.  That’s pretty much how I see it too.

      • Anonymous

        nah,. my point about the consistent laptime was ” thats how easy the game was to adjust to – its still pretty bland and uninvolving to drive.”    Not about the laptimes themselves.
        i.e. – for a seasoned simracer like myself, it doesn’t take long to find the limits in the game because there isn’t much depth to the driving yet, especially under braking. the car stops, accelerates, and steers in a very ‘basic’ way (and i explained why above that). you can be consistent in any simgame, in my world trophy races on FSR league our laptimes are within tenths and half tenths of each other. its just that in rfactor you feel the car moving about, and you feel it responding to your every input, and you can make fine precise adjustments on all the inputs. At the moment, that isn’t required with CARS to achieve consistent fast laptimes. 

      • mirza mirza

         This is exactly what I think about pCARS and have said this numerous times private conversations with my friends, the depth of the drive it self is missing, I miss some better defined drive when the car is around the limit and over it, with better feed back of what it is doing. 

  • tgn motorsports

    Saying Rfactor 1 is better the pcars is like saying a double wide trailer on a pig farm is better then a mansion on the waterway. 
    Really while I think all race games serve a purpose  in some way or another, but it is like saying f1 98-2002 is better then f1 2010. LOL.  
    Maybe turn your aids off and buy some glasses. (I have all of games above installed and then some on my 4tb pc. Have played all extensively with no aids and on various wheels, monitors, projectors and big screens small screens and so on.)

    • Anonymous

      Well I’m impressed.  4Tb eh ? And various wheels, projectors and big screen…   wow I wanna be your friend !

      But who’s building mansions on waterways ?  The foundations would never hold up.
      Still at least tgn has provided the beginning for a new round of arguing from out of nowhere.  Well done, you must be proud.

      • tgn motorsports

         The foundations would never hold up.

        I guess ? Which world? And no they hold up fine just like my point.

        http://youtu.be/TATBgJOgTy4

      • Anonymous

        Oh you mean NEAR or BESIDE the waterway.  I thought you said ON the waterway. 🙂

        So this rF1 argument and the ‘people should buy glasses’ remark…  where’s all this suddenly coming from at the 11th hour ?

      • tgn motorsports

         Last time I checked on the waterway and in the waterway are TWO completely different things.

        But from seeing a lot of that waterway firsthand I guess you can most likely say there actually is  a lot of mansions in the waterway (not just the ones ON THE WATERWAY)  except they move and float.  🙂

        As far as the rf1 11 hour thing, I can pick holes in almost any race sim. The fact is people seem to love whatever there most involved with and feel the need to defend it as if it was there child.

        I like the isi engine/gMotor-engine2 , it has gave us a lot of entertainment for years in many different forms. Rfactor was not a polished or user friendly ui  lets be real here. Also has the code from papyrus games which is still the base code for Iracing.  Time for CHANGE. this IS NOT 1998 or  2005.

        As far as you being condescending or humorous,  about that you want to be my friend, well sure!
        (if i get a shinny blue sheriff star can i be condescending to my guests too? )

        The point was to make I am not a fly by night person to the auto sim hobby and have been playing race games since around 1976. I don’t limit or border my expectations of my hobby.
         To bad I had to spell that out. Seems to be a communication gap it seems.

    • Anonymous

      In my opinion, F1 98-2002 Challenge on PC was a hell of a lot better than any of the codemasters arcade F1 games.  Infact, Microprose GP4 is so much better in gameplay, AI and graphics than any of the Codemasters disasters.  So your opinion is very different.  So with that in mind, someone can say that RF is better than PCars.  Unless you just like pretty screens?

  • Matt Orr

    zomg the noise.

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