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Really looking forward to this. I hope that the visuals are great as well as the potential physics. The rfactor devs have gotten tons of feedback from rfactor modders so rfactor 2 should be really good. I want a more hardcore version of gran turismo 5 for the pc :)

I repost from other rf2 Article:

Sorry but the graphics are REALLY outdated… Looks 99% like rFactor 1…

The Cockpits are ugly compared to Shifts/Ferrari Project one (there was a very similar Single Seater) …

If they could build in Reflections and nice dynamic Light/Shadows – rFactor 2 would look awesome…

amazing and amazing I may have subscribed to iRacing but rFactor still flows in my blood like nothing else

From rF2 article:
image are in poor quality, but imho looks good.

The screenshots could not have been smaller than this

Sommergemüse: I repost from other rf2 Article:Sorry but the graphics are REALLY outdated… Looks 99% like rFactor 1…The Cockpits are ugly compared to Shifts/Ferrari Project one (there was a very similar Single Seater) …If they could build in Reflections and nice dynamic Light/Shadows – rFactor 2 would look awesome…

The shots were taken with a camera, and the game is nowhere near finished.

I’m not saying it won’t look old, but refrain from commenting on the graphics until release…

The first picture, of the UI, looks a lot like the one in F1 Challenge ’99- ’02.

I like it very much. You can see awesome potential underneath.

Thanks ISI!

Sommergemüse: …If they could build in Reflections and nice dynamic Light/Shadows – rFactor 2 would look awesome…

You can’t see it in these screens, but I was under the impression rF2 had these features?

Good to see ISI is concentrating their efforts on the game itself, not on creating a marketing hype like other games…

MAybe they work on the graphics – I don’t know but the shown Screenshots are all Technically Outdated

And I know that these are “bad” Pictures taken from a Movie ;)

Siggs:
You can’t see it in these screens, but I was under the impression rF2 had these features?

They have indeed been featured in other screenshots, with enough detail that it seems that cars can now cast shadows on themselves.

I worry that the UI and HUD are going to be out-of-date again, though. It looks as if their UI font is the same as Speed Channel’s, and while it would be kind of neat to have that feel, it’s a feel that already seems dated whenever Speed broadcasts an event. Obviously they’re probably a long way from release so the UI likely isn’t final, but I would like to see something a little more compact and minimalist.

The unidentified third car is a Panoz.

Can’t really judge much from these shots. They are extremely low res and you can see were taken in windowed mode.

In my opinion, doesn’t matters if graphics are not better than an old rF.

What we want are incredible physics, dinamic weather an things like that…

Keep spectacular graphics for games who can’t offer nothing more.

I can’t understand the attitude towards graphics in Race Sims. When I watch my replays in rFactor (especially with a high quality mod) I still find the visuals beautiful. Yes Shift does look amazing, but that ended up coming at the cost of a good driving experience.

I can’t compare the likes of Forza 3 and GT5 as I’ve never played them with a wheel so it wouldn’t be fair to comment.

My main racing comes from Simbin, but some of my favourite mods are in rFactor. Though I prefer the slightly better “connected” feeling I get in Simbins titles some rF mods with good realfeel settings come close.

If rFactor 2 can improve on the feel and have better FFB out of the box, then a slightly enhanced visual experience will be enough for me and with the implementation of real wether effects etc then I have no doubt that rF2 will be a winner .

Having said all that, we haven’t seen rF2 in action properly yet and we could end being blown away by it.

Anyway I’m returning to iRacing aftera year away and hopefully that will keep me going until rF2 hits the ground.

If you guys read the original post here http://www.racesimcentral.com/news/2010/03/rfactor2-spy-photos-from-inside-sim-racing-video/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rfactor2-spy-photos-from-inside-sim-racing-video (which we didn’t know was going out, Mitch is in trouble) those were off a camera that was shooting 720×480 and capturing it off of windowed mode.

It looks a LOT better than rF1. Those pictures weren’t supposed to be released. They’re not even pictures.. They’re screen captures off of digital footage.

Our running footage looks a lot better.. By the way, Gjon was not prepared to show us. We begged and pleaded and got something off of his lap top that he uses for email..lol. By no means was it a gaming laptop.

Darin Gangi
Inside Sim Racing

crobol: In my opinion, doesn’t matters if graphics are not better than an old rF.What we want are incredible physics, dinamic weather an things like that… Keep spectacular graphics for games who can’t offer nothing more.

Full Ack

Sommergemüse: I repost from other rf2 Article:Sorry but the graphics are REALLY outdated… Looks 99% like rFactor 1…The Cockpits are ugly compared to Shifts/Ferrari Project one (there was a very similar Single Seater) …If they could build in Reflections and nice dynamic Light/Shadows – rFactor 2 would look awesome…

Graphics aren’t important…
The need is for a high quality motor environnement, with dynamic wheater, dynamic lights, shadows and reflects, great physics abilities, and all this potential will be improve by modders.
Look at the quality of firts rFactor realeases, and compare with today.
The quality even graphics has been really improved.
rFactor isn’t obsolete today. His great power exist by his ability to be programmed.
Don’t be anxious by graphics, all we need is a big customizable game.
I would prefer have a game with well integrated modding tools, big customization possibilities…

(And nice Raidillon screenshots)

Hi all,

In something that is intended to be a SIM or let’s say believable experience Graphics, Physics and other details are important at the same level. So I do not understand to people saying graphics are not important. Are at less as important to get a balanced and good product. And now there a lot of resources and technology to improve them and put some focus in it is as need than physics and etc.

I hope Rfactor2 be able to push more in that area and get to be similar in graphics to Codemasters or at less to Shift. Because remember that driving it’s feeling; driving and hearing and visuals.

Regards, B.

I Agree complete creatorex

Nice screens.

ISRacing:

Thanks for that little bit of extra info Darin
.

Y E S:
Graphics aren’t important…

It’s now 2010: graphic is an important aspect of the sim too. There are enough resources to make it right and I believe ISI won’t disappoint us in this sense.

Graphics are verrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry verrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry important and anyone that says otherwise should go back to the 90s

What??? Visual graphic immersion does not matter in a VIDEO game simulation?? Is this a joke?? Anyway, seriously, each has his opinions of course, so no problem. Personally I agree fully with Creatorex and others. And, yes, I just can’t wait to drive on such SPA…my preferred F1 circuit in the world!

And, by the way, let me also say a BIG THANK YOU to Gjon & co. at ISI for rF1 (…many, many hours of fun and passions I’ve got out of it…) as well as for your efforts to do the best possible in the new rF2. Be sure that I’ll find the cash needed to buy it when it comes out….

regards

creatorex: Hi all,In something that is intended to be a SIM or let’s say believable experience Graphics, Physics and other details are important at the same level. So I do not understand to people saying graphics are not important. Are at less as important to get a balanced and good product. And now there a lot of resources and technology to improve them and put some focus in it is as need than physics and etc.
I hope Rfactor2 be able to push more in that area and get to be similar in graphics to Codemasters or at less to Shift. Because remember that driving it’s feeling; driving and hearing and visuals.Regards, B.

What I mean when I say “the graphics are not important” is that this is not the most important parameter…
(my English is pretty bad, and it is difficult to make me understand)

Personally, I don’t judge this future rFactor on some screens.
What I expect is a game engine that allows a lot of customization.
If today we could have in rFactor 1, lights, shadows and dynamic reflections, we would play yet a game as beautiful as NF Shift (look at the 3d in Shift, it’s not very nice… What is nice, it’s dynamic lights, shadows and reflects).

By the way, I also have NF Shift, and although it is very beautiful, I never much played rFactor, which is a game older than 5 years, and with obsolete graphics.
If graphics were important to me, I wouldn’t play rFactor any more for a long time…

But rFactor 1 has big limitations in terms of physics engine.
And today, we are able to make beautiful things in textures, but we can not change the rFacor 1 physics engine limitations.

So what I want most is an easy game to customize and big customization possibilities …
And this is something that is not seen on screen (this said, I’d already be happy to drive in the second screenshot ^_^).
The beautiful graphics, it will come with the achievements of the modding scene.

@ Darin; you gotta love all this papparazzi/espionage drama! Don’t be too mad a Mitch (maybe a slap or two across his face with your driving gloves challenging him to a ‘duel’, that is ‘racing duel’ to teach him a lesson.) Most any publicity is good publicity, usually.

@ Everyone else; most of us are still enjoying rFactor immensely so do we really think that rF2 will be a step backwards? Of course not, and I know ya’all don’t really think so. You’re just saying what’s on your mind because you probably want to convey your ideas, wishes, passion and support to Gjon Camaj and his rFactor 2 dev team.

I enjoy reading all of your posts, and whether I agree with them or not doesn’t matter because it somehow helps to broaden my perspective which in turn fuels my love of sim racing. Thanks everyone!

I’m for previews but this, common i dont get it.

720p at least or nothing please.

Graphic are the first ingredient for immersion, it’s the most important thing then it’s physics.

rF came out in 2005, rF 2 should look way better than rF1 because its not meant to be a kleenex (tissue) game, it will last many years.

Old F1 and F2, modern GT cars, dirt trucks, the only thing missing to be perfect is a series of 80′s.

…and, sorry, I forgot to say a BIG THANKS also to the VIRTUALR guys who have tried their best to offer us what is “available”… The usual game between “developers” – who want to control media – and “journalists” – who try to grab out as much as possible. And it’s normal that is like this, and I prefer poor shots than no shots at all!

So, keep up the good work, VitualR guys, as you’ve made your site becoming a real news reference for many in the Community.

lucao: So, keep up the good work, VitualR guys, as you’ve made your site becoming a real news reference for many in the Community.

+1

Dunno if i’m wrong, but just only a guy work on this marvellous place: Montoya ;)
thanks for all mate!

eddiespag:Are most of us are still enjoying rFactor immensely so do we really think that rF2 will be a step backwards?

No-ones made me think in that way before, very well said

I’m pretty sure that rF2 will be stronger on the physics side and CM’s F1 2010 will be stronger on the graphics, which does not mean none of them is unusable. And for rF1 we saw big differences in terms of graphics quality depending on what modders could achieve (take VLM’s great tracks for example). In the end you can’t have everything and I think the graphics will not blow us away. However I still believe that the overall package will deliver a great sim. Crying won’t help anyway and in the end everyone has to decide whether or not to buy it or to go for F1 2010.

Sommergemüse, I completely agree. I could care less about the drivability of the sim. All I do is watch replays all day anyways so graphics are top priority for me. Shift has much better graphics. I took a screen shot of a screen shot on my monitor from across the street and then did some heavy JPEG compression on it just to show how amazing Shift’s graphics are. You can see it here:
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_uYOHybRTJFA/S6OnqmyWWTI/AAAAAAAAAPw/Lqh0K0f1-AU/SAM_0036.JPG

Check out that amazing cockpit, HDR lighting, bloom and dynamic shadows. Just breath taking. rF2 has nothing on Shift. I know because I have studied each 320×240 screenshot of rF2 for hours.

If I want to look at good graphics I go to other racing games. If I want something real I go to sims.

I do not want the people working on the sim wasting time on graphics, if it could have been spent making the sim more realistic in other ways.

awesome post!

ermax18: Sommergemüse, I completely agree. I could care less about the drivability of the sim. All I do is watch replays all day anyways so graphics are top priority for me. Shift has much better graphics. I took a screen shot of a screen shot on my monitor from across the street and then did some heavy JPEG compression on it just to show how amazing Shift’s graphics are. You can see it here:
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_uYOHybRTJFA/S6OnqmyWWTI/AAAAAAAAAPw/Lqh0K0f1-AU/SAM_0036.JPGCheck out that amazing cockpit, HDR lighting, bloom and dynamic shadows. Just breath taking. rF2 has nothing on Shift. I know because I have studied each 320×240 screenshot of rF2 for hours.

I am sure most of us will be amazed when rF2 hits your PC.

Crazy Bored:I do not want the people working on the sim wasting time on graphics, if it could have been spent making the sim more realistic in other ways.

Really doubt the same people are working on physics and graphics development.

However, we allready have realtime reflections and self shadowing confirmed,
which sets me optimistic graphics will look good

Had totally forgotten we were getting Spa 67 in this… SOOOOOOOO excited to race that again. Many happy races around there in GPL. (Often dying multiple times at Masta…)

I love how you’re all so quick to condemn the graphics when it’s a crappy JPG of a crappy video.

Even rFactor can still look good given a recent, high quality, mod and track.

ISI’s priority should be ease of use, mods/tracks should all have a simple install/uninstall method, while the likes of the FFB should be standardised, with no need to tailor each mod individually.

BSR-WiX: I am sure most of us will be amazed when rF2 hits your PC.

we hope !! =)

ermax18: Sommergemüse, I completely agree. I could care less about the drivability of the sim. All I do is watch replays all day anyways so graphics are top priority for me. Shift has much better graphics. I took a screen shot of a screen shot on my monitor from across the street and then did some heavy JPEG compression on it just to show how amazing Shift’s graphics are. You can see it here:
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_uYOHybRTJFA/S6OnqmyWWTI/AAAAAAAAAPw/Lqh0K0f1-AU/SAM_0036.JPGCheck out that amazing cockpit, HDR lighting, bloom and dynamic shadows. Just breath taking. rF2 has nothing on Shift. I know because I have studied each 320×240 screenshot of rF2 for hours.

I believe this is what is categorized as, Win.

6e66o:
Really doubt the same people are working on physics and graphics development.However, we allready have realtime reflections and self shadowing confirmed,
which sets me optimistic graphics will look good

If this is true and not shown on this pics .. I think I could be happy too :)

Lets wait for better pictures

the cockpit pictures from the classic opewheeler looks awesome, if you take away the photoquality you clearly can se the immersion and the feeling of depth, Im very pleased!

A new Forum Site must to appear to group modder community around rF2 again.

I’m not saying virtualR must to do dat, but after the lost of all information on RSC, a new and independent forum will be necessary.

OK I know, my words have no relationship with this thread, but needed to say…

Maybe ISI can create a Forum on his servers to became a meeting-point af modding developing, and technical troubles & questions….

There are a few big independent forums left… NoGrip or Racedepartment for example.

What people have to remember here is that this game is still in development and as Darin mentioned above, Gjon wasn’t ready to show them things, he only did so because they begged and pleaded. I am pretty sure that what we’ve seen here and what we’ll see in the next SRT Episode will be barely a snippet of what the game has in possibilities.

A lot of people are comparing the game’s graphics in the current screenshots and saying that they’d want them to be something along the lines of NFS Shift or Codemaster’s games. What you have to remember here that these games by those companies on the PC were a lot less graphical then their console counterparts. The more things you add to a game, the more you have to withdraw on the visual, why? because if you don’t, the more higher end comp is required to play it and lets face it, not everyone who sim races has the money to afford a 5000 dollar masterpiece comp.

ISI have decided to branch away from the simplicity in rFactor and to provide us with a game that we have been wanting. Dynamic (Selectable) weather changes and effects, Wind factor implementation which is editable by the player, new layout of gameplay which brings a more professional atmosphere to the game for the player.

In addition, this title is going to make it that much harder for the common lower end mod groups to perform mods. The need to make animations will be a requirement now when making mods. Lower end groups who don’t have animators will be faced with dilemma’s. But nothing that they can’t get through of course with time. rFactor 2 however will make it so that a lot of the low end mods that either die out before release or die out quick after release will not be able to be made in rF2 or at least not without a lot of work and changes. rF2 asks for quality in every aspect and mods that will come out on rF2 will be far more superior in their lowest form then many of the higher known mods in rF1.

In regards to graphics. It is really stupid to begin bagging the game on graphics before release. Some people did that with rF1, remember guys? boy their faces must have been red when rF1 came out. In addition, since rF2 is being built with the purpose to allow the modding community to advance to a new level of professional modding, it will only be a matter of time before you start getting high end graphical mods to enjoy. Will you then still care if the base is a little lower end field if the mods are high spec? I don’t think anyone will cause the mods would be more played then the base game itself.

Gjon and the boys over at ISI have taken up a daunting task in my view. They are trying to provide every possible aspect they can for the players but ensuring that the graphical abilities of the game do not diminish too much. As gamers, we must also be mindful of this fact. The more content we want in a game, the more we have to sacrifice in the sence of visual and graphical power. Its a balance that developers need to pick and gamers need to understand and accept.

I myself am really looking forward to this game and I think that people should not really judge it badly on the graphics side until they actually have it. I think those who do judge it will be more surprised then not.

But thats just my two cents on the matter.

Petros_MakIn addition, this title is going to make it that much harder for the common lower end mod groups to perform mods. The need to make animations will be a requirement now when making mods. Lower end groups who don’t have animators will be faced with dilemma’s.

There’s no way to know that until ISI releases a statement on it or we have the game. It could very well be set up like Simbin’s games where you just input the coordinates and your good to go.

It could be yes, but animations even on simbin mods are not as easy as that. Especially for GTR Evo. To give you an example, we had to re-size our steering wheels to fit the GTR Evo driver arm animations simply because we didn’t have the frame amount required to make our own. This will most likely be the same way in rF2, if ISI release the animation frame counts, then people will be able to make new animations using those frame counts. The reason its vital to have the exact frame count is to ensure that when new ones are made, they are not shorter or longer then the required amount and make the mod look bad. Not to mention pit crew animations. You will have to manually edit the animations to reflect the areas the crew have to stand in accordance to the mod’s car. This is just common animation practice. Now sure, ISI may find a way to implement the editing of this easier for the user, and maybe they won’t, it is something we will have to wait to see as you say, thats for sure. Hopefully the process won’t be that arduous but at the same time, I do think its better for the game to force a more higher quality from modders as that will ensure the modding community doesn’t stick to the normal and common stuff we see game after game and actually moves modders to a more professional level.

In any case, there is no doubt that rF2 will be the game to beat in regards to content and flexibility and with the ability to be modded, the community will have much to wait for. One thing that I like about ISI is not only that they support the modding community by making yet another moddable game, but by also helping the modding community advance to a higher level by making their game require certain aspects to be more professionally done. This to me is the best thing as it helps people becoming better, learn new methods and give the community more and more great mods that they deserve to have. Essentially, it helps the modding community grow more and more and thats what we need isn’t it?

As to how hard or complex the game will be compared to rF1. Gjon did state in an earlier interview with SRT last year that rF2 will require more professionally done work and even porting from rF1 to rF2 won’t be as easy as just copying and pasting, a lot more elements need to be worked in to the mod for it to work on rF2. This clearly is raising the level of what modders need to know and allows them to see somewhat how things are developed on a much larger scale.

In any case, I think we can all agree that rF2 is the one to watch especially for the modding community. :)

It will most likely be similar in the change from F1C to rfactor. I don’t expect it to be copy/paste and don’t desire it to be that way either. No fun in that. I do hope that the overall quality of mods in general takes a step up. But we both know once everything is figured out you can count on 90% of whats available now for rf being ported.

All I ask is how about not having 10 different same year F1 mods. Lets put aside egos and pool the resources and put some quality content out there.

On the Evo thing I know its a pain with the drivers if you want to use the newer higher poly models. The difference though between Simbin and ISI is ISI will most likely give us the proper tools.

Petros_Mak: In any case, I think we can all agree that rF2 is the one to watch especially for the modding community. :)

RF2 will be for modding and pure simracers the joy of our life for the next 5-7 years, the next step of real online racing, a step foward that means a lot to me since ISI is the only one to keep their roots alive.

Every body asking for great Graphics but your post says it all, so for me, i have to say:

RESPECT GJON AND THE REST OF THE TEAM!!!!!

LOL…I can’t believe some of you guy’s are even commenting that the graphics look bad or like F1C, when the pics are taken of a computer screen with a crappy resoulution camera.

But you’ll be the first in line for a copy when it arrives.

@scca: I’m pretty sure you are right in the fact that 90% of the mods on rF will be ported over to rF2, but then, how many of those groups are still active? Most have lost their key members and will struggle, but it is possible that 90% of the mods will be ported over whether by the original creators or current/new groups that acquire the rights to do so.

I agree with you in one sense that having 10 of the same year mod is a bit ridiculous, but alas thats how it is. Ego’s is one thing with everyone wanting power and to boss people around, another is the level of work ethic each person has and I’ll give you an example on this.

Take CTDP for example. One of the most well known and respected modding groups in the community and for a very right reason. I mean they’ve worked hard on many different sims including F1 2002 and have been around during the years competing with RH Modding Group too before RH was picked up by Blimey/SMS. They work on their mods producing the best quality they can in the time that suits them, what do they get out of it from many in the community? bitching and moaning that they take so long to do a 2 year old+ season. That fair? no.

Then take FSOne, a group that MAK-Corp (back then MMG) made a merger with. What were the differences between the groups and why the merger didn’t work? Completely different mindsets at the time. We strived for absolute accuracy and ensuring that every bug was fixed regardless how much longer we had to work. FSOne felt that they had spent enough time and let the bug just be there. Nowadays however they do not do that and they create nice work, but that mindset back then was one of the problems stopping us from putting resources together.

The entire ego thing is another thing. Everyone wants to be the main leader, everyone wants to make their name show up in lights. Why do I not post much online? because I really, honestly, don’t care if people notice me or see me as the leader. All I care about is concentrating on the work my group has to do and thats that.

But due to the fact everyone wants to be their own boss, me included, you find it hard to work on a project with other groups when the leader and workers of each group don’t share the same work ethic or goals. Its reasons why teams like CTDP, FSOne, MMG, VLM, GSMF, and many others stick to themselves and hire others to join them to complete work. Is it wrong? no, as all development companies in life do the same thing, modding is just as much a competition between groups as game development is a competition between developing companies.

Is it sad? yes, it is sad that groups resort to their ego’s and slandering each other and bashing each other and spreading rumors of each other. Its sad because there is no reason why we as groups cannot help each other, learn from each other and grow to greater heights together as a mod developing community. It is very sad and keeps the community in a stalemate of not growing further quicker.

I myself as many of you know am the constant slander of Danny and others in the community. FSone is from others, CTDP also have their own slanderers. But in the end of the day, we are all human beings trying to run our groups to make mods for all of you to enjoy. When I first began MMG, yes the dream was to unite modders and to work on a similar vision. RH, CTDP at the time were my goals. RH with his infinite wisdom for whom I thank for sharing with me over the years told me why it was not possible to achieve that goal, and he was right. CTDP loathe us and especially me since Andy won’t even speak to me, and for what? for something others have done whom I am supposedly responsible for. FSOne hate me due to the merger issue which was caused by Phil. Then you have groups that hate other groups that steal content like F1RL and WCP that have been under the firing line.

For me when I look at other groups, I see the potential the community has. Sure CTDP hates me, but the fact is, Andy is a great leader who has led his team for many many years. CTDP strive for utmost quality and work ethic which is also what we strive for. They are passionate modders with a lot of potential.

FSOne are a group of passionate modders run by Codex who is one of the nicest people you’ll meet online. Now that they too strive for accuracy they too are a strong force to be reckoned with.

But even through all that, the sad part is, we still cannot put resources together to work with each other. The desires of one will surpass another, and the first time one of all involved doesn’t agree, thats pretty much the beginning of the end for the project.

If groups could find a way to help each other and remain seperate as they are, then the modding community would thrive further. Hopefully someday those involved will try to form new relations and instead of having ten of the same mods, we may be able to have a much larger quantity of different mods at a higher quality level. Sadly however, I don’t see it happening. I’m one of those who’d be more then willing to help other groups and have done so in the past with LMT and others and hope some of the other groups will begin doing so too. The aspect of the work we do is not only to make ourselves bigger and take ourselves to new horizons, but its to also help the modding community grow and as groups, I feel we are responsible to helping lower end groups and new groups learn. One can only hope that someday it will be the case that ego’s will be left aside and groups will help each other more.

Petros_Mak: @scca: I’m pretty sure you are right in the fact that 90% of the mods on rF will be ported over to rF2, but then, how many of those groups are still active? Most have lost their key members and will struggle, but it is possible that 90% of the mods will be ported over whether by the original creators or current/new groups that acquire the rights to do so.I agree with you in one sense that having 10 of the same year mod is a bit ridiculous, but alas thats how it is. Ego’s is one thing with everyone wanting power and to boss people around, another is the level of work ethic each person has and I’ll give you an example on this.Take CTDP for example. One of the most well known and respected modding groups in the community and for a very right reason. I mean they’ve worked hard on many different sims including F1 2002 and have been around during the years competing with RH Modding Group too before RH was picked up by Blimey/SMS. They work on their mods producing the best quality they can in the time that suits them, what do they get out of it from many in the community? bitching and moaning that they take so long to do a 2 year old+ season. That fair? no.Then take FSOne, a group that MAK-Corp (back then MMG) made a merger with. What were the differences between the groups and why the merger didn’t work? Completely different mindsets at the time. We strived for absolute accuracy and ensuring that every bug was fixed regardless how much longer we had to work. FSOne felt that they had spent enough time and let the bug just be there. Nowadays however they do not do that and they create nice work, but that mindset back then was one of the problems stopping us from putting resources together.The entire ego thing is another thing. Everyone wants to be the main leader, everyone wants to make their name show up in lights. Why do I not post much online? because I really, honestly, don’t care if people notice me or see me as the leader. All I care about is concentrating on the work my group has to do and thats that.But due to the fact everyone wants to be their own boss, me included, you find it hard to work on a project with other groups when the leader and workers of each group don’t share the same work ethic or goals. Its reasons why teams like CTDP, FSOne, MMG, VLM, GSMF, and many others stick to themselves and hire others to join them to complete work. Is it wrong? no, as all development companies in life do the same thing, modding is just as much a competition between groups as game development is a competition between developing companies.Is it sad? yes, it is sad that groups resort to their ego’s and slandering each other and bashing each other and spreading rumors of each other. Its sad because there is no reason why we as groups cannot help each other, learn from each other and grow to greater heights together as a mod developing community. It is very sad and keeps the community in a stalemate of not growing further quicker.I myself as many of you know am the constant slander of Danny and others in the community. FSone is from others, CTDP also have their own slanderers. But in the end of the day, we are all human beings trying to run our groups to make mods for all of you to enjoy. When I first began MMG, yes the dream was to unite modders and to work on a similar vision. RH, CTDP at the time were my goals. RH with his infinite wisdom for whom I thank for sharing with me over the years told me why it was not possible to achieve that goal, and he was right. CTDP loathe us and especially me since Andy won’t even speak to me, and for what? for something others have done whom I am supposedly responsible for. FSOne hate me due to the merger issue which was caused by Phil. Then you have groups that hate other groups that steal content like F1RL and WCP that have been under the firing line.For me when I look at other groups, I see the potential the community has. Sure CTDP hates me, but the fact is, Andy is a great leader who has led his team for many many years. CTDP strive for utmost quality and work ethic which is also what we strive for. They are passionate modders with a lot of potential.FSOne are a group of passionate modders run by Codex who is one of the nicest people you’ll meet online. Now that they too strive for accuracy they too are a strong force to be reckoned with.But even through all that, the sad part is, we still cannot put resources together to work with each other. The desires of one will surpass another, and the first time one of all involved doesn’t agree, thats pretty much the beginning of the end for the project.If groups could find a way to help each other and remain seperate as they are, then the modding community would thrive further. Hopefully someday those involved will try to form new relations and instead of having ten of the same mods, we may be able to have a much larger quantity of different mods at a higher quality level. Sadly however, I don’t see it happening. I’m one of those who’d be more then willing to help other groups and have done so in the past with LMT and others and hope some of the other groups will begin doing so too. The aspect of the work we do is not only to make ourselves bigger and take ourselves to new horizons, but its to also help the modding community grow and as groups, I feel we are responsible to helping lower end groups and new groups learn. One can only hope that someday it will be the case that ego’s will be left aside and groups will help each other more.

Can you estimate your skills everytime before taking? I guess a lot of us are tired of your talks already.

Could you either go back to topic or, please, reduce the size of your epic monologues. And by the way, imho it stinks that you use this opportunity and open a completely differnt box talking about what you call “slanderers”. Why don’t you do this on your own homepage!?

It’s quiet frustrating to see that rF 2 is presented on a Laptop.

720p with the graphic filtering on max should be the least.

Historic F1 with all the good old tracks (ok, modders got a job to make most of the tracks) combined with a dynamic weather system is gold for pure fun and exciting league racing.

And about the graphic quality we have seen in rf1 that a few modders have risen the quality to new heights. It will be exciting to see the new visual capabilities of the rf2 engine.

It`s both the gameplay and modding capabilities + community that makes this game so damn fun and exciting.

The historic F1 looks like a Matra MS10. Since Meganes are also featured in othe rF2 shots, ISI seem to have got a licencing agreement with Renault and I think Renault now own Matra. The MS80 is the one I’d have gone for, but hey at least its not fictional.

The field of view in those shots is very narrow for a racing sim, not neccessarily a bad thing and I’m sure its adjustable. Also I would expect the rev counter to be visible under the rim of the wheel rather than half of it over but maybe the seat height is at its max. The gloves look good – having come from GPL and Rally Trophy, rF’s cockpit view always seemed to have something missing.

I personally fail to understand how graphics can be the most important feature of a racing sim; a racing game yes, but a sim? I don’t believe so. For me, wanting ultra realistic graphics is being somewhat spoilt. I grew up watching tv on a small screen with poor reception…did it ruin my viewing experience? Not at all, because I could still see and hear the programs, and ultimately still found myself just as immersed as I would have been in a cinema. Sure, it would have been nice to have had a cinema-type experience every time I watched the news, or whatever, but alas I made do with the basics.

For me the same applies with regards to racing sims. Yes, I would love for it to be so realistic that I could fool anyone into believing it was a HD video of an actual race. However, that would require the spending of lots of money; I would need a hi end pc, the biggest and best quality monitors and the ultimate sound systems…. I have none of that, I have a basic pc with a small-ish monitor and use cheap headphones. If I was going to spend thousands on all this equipment, I would purchase the most realistic experience of them all instead, actually go real life racing!

Anyway, when I drive [for arguments sake] rFactor, I still get a huge buzz because when I feel the car’s behaviour through my force feedback wheel, and I see images that resemble a car and track, and hear sounds that resemble a screaming race car, then my brain does this remarkable thing… it ignores the fact that I am sitting at a desk in my bedroom, and lets me believe that I am actually in a race car!

If you require ultra realistic graphics to complete your virtual driving experience, then fair enough, but for me that just suggests a lack of imagination.

The thing with graphics is its easy to take them for granted and think they don’t matter. Try installing ISIs original Sports Car GT or even F1-2000 and you will realise just how far we have come in terms of graphics. I really don’t think most simmers could live with SCGT graphics even with iRacing physics.

And you probably don’t need a high end PC to enjoy the improved graphics, as rF doesn’t make use of the power of most PCs built in the last couple of years. I was amazed how fast Shift ran on my PC (after the patch) – it ran faster than rF ran when it came out.

And also remember we will still probably be using rF2 in five years time. Sims which push the boundaries in terms of graphics when they are released such as GP2 and GPL tend to have long lives.

I think you might be on to something there WhiteRose. I definitely have a lack of imagination and thus probably require higher quality graphics to be satisfied. Of course for a racing sim (that aims to be realistic) the car physics and force feedback comes first, but for me the graphics and sound come in a very close second.

The people wanting Grid and Dirt like Graphics don’t seem to understand the budgets involved in those games, It’s quite sad really that they are trying to put ISI down when they do one hell of a job with the small budget they have.

WhiteRose:
If you require ultra realistic graphics to complete your virtual driving experience, then fair enough, but for me that just suggests a lack of imagination.

I second what David Wright said.

Anyway,
i´m sure rF2 will be better then rf1 in both aspects,
physics & graphics.

Impressive what arguments are used here to defend the lack of graphics power in rF2. It’s a sim, but nevertheless it is a game. And if i spend money on a (race)game, i want it to bring me great quality in all aspects. i want great graphics, great sounds, great physics, great presentation and great support.

I bought NFS Shift and regret it, because its physics are really…console arcade shit, the AI is shit and the online mode is just the worst thing i ever had to see in a game i bought. But i also saw its graphics power, the cockpit view and the feeling it generates. and when i switch back to rF1, i just have to yawn.

So why should a race sim be an argument to just focus on physics and forget all the other important aspects that generate an overall experience. Furthermore, i want more people to try out race sims. And if rF2 looks like 5 year old games, the younger generation will not care about rF2. So i can only hope that ISI realizes that they are not just making a sim, they are making a game.

I dare Petros to take part in these forums and for a week not comment anything over 50 words…. My God man! It’s boring just to see your name, because you know a damn speech is about to follow…

NightSt@lk3r: The people wanting Grid and Dirt like Graphics don’t seem to understand the budgets involved in those games, It’s quite sad really that they are trying to put ISI down when they do one hell of a job with the small budget they have.

I think that nobody’s asking for Grid or Dirt graphics here (also because they’re full of overexaggerated effects which make those games far away from being realistic): we’re just hoping for something that would help in recreate real life experience, just like a good light system, proper reflections and so on. Those things can be achieved even with Dx9.

Shum94: It’s quiet frustrating to see that rF 2 is presented on a Laptop.720p with the graphic filtering on max should be the least.

Remember it was spyshots not a gaming PC for show.
I think it looks good, it is a vast improvement from the ‘old’ rFactor and to me it looks like it will be close to iRacing graphics.
Let’s hope the physics will be as close as well.

@Tensor: maybe you are right in the end, but atm I cannot see why you claim rF2 should look like 5 years old although there is not even a demo out. And I also think you should not say they “just focus on physics”. Finally, there must be a reason why we have never had a “perfect sim” with perfect graphics, physics, user friendliness, modding features, etc.

@Uff: completely agree, and I think we really need good light effects and reflections because imo this will add most to make things look more real.

I also wonder if some features will be hold back and further developed before adding them as a patch later on. Finally, screenshots do not always tell the truth. We need some “pictures in motion”.

Patience my friends patience

Graphics are very important indeed because the better they look the more immersive the simulation is, but physics for me are the big priority :)

Agreed. I don’t want Grid type graphics. They might look “cool” or whatever but not very realistic. Better lighting/shading and reflections will make a nice improvement. Screen Space Ambient Occlusion (SSAO) would be a nice addition.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screen_Space_Ambient_Occlusion

Firefox:
Remember it was spyshots not a gaming PC for show.
I think it looks good, it is a vast improvement from the ‘old’ rFactor and to me it looks like it will be close to iRacing graphics.
Let’s hope the physics will be as close as well.

What we will see in the next Inside Sim Racing episode is rFactor 2 showed on a TV ran by a laptop.
The screen preview with the pick up truck car shows that there is no full filtering on the game, i regret that.

f0xx: Patience my friends patience Graphics are very important indeed because the better they look the more immersive the simulation is, but physics for me are the big priority :)

The thing with physics is no two sim racers will agree on what “good” physics are :) As a group we say we want realistic physics but as a group we don’t really know what realistic physics are. Look at the reaction to every new mod or sim which comes out.

The other thing is because rF/rF2 is really all about mods, even if you have the best physics engine in the world, if modders don’t know what to do with it, or the “right” numbers to use, the physics will be “wrong”.

In an ideal world I would want ultra realistic graphics, incredible sounds, and amazing “physics”. However, as this is the real world, I would much rather a company developing a game aimed at the simulation market spend their limited money, time and resources on making sure the car behaviour and track layout was believable. Graphics should be a secondary concern; they shouldn’t be neglected, but no need to make their creation the number one drain on resources. However, if the target market is aimed at casual gamers, then graphics should become more important as beautiful looking games are what sell these days.

My point is that with regards to “simulations” I would much rather play an ugly looking game that accurately depicts car handling than a drop-dead gorgeous photo realistic game that only vaguely captures the true-life behaviour of a race car. I can accept the latter for my casual relaxing gaming experiencing (e.g. Forza 3), but for pc-based simulation experiences I want the former (e.g. RBR).

We can’t have everything; if rFactor 2 was to have 100% realistic graphics, 100% realistic track layouts, 100% realistic sounds and 100% realistic physics, it would a) never get completed and we would still be waiting for it a decade or two later, and b) they would need to charge us customers a fortune to make any profit on it (especially considering how relatively small the race-sim market is compared to others).

As it happens, I think the graphics in the above captures look perfectly fine, but I guess visually I’m easily pleased

Mr. A: Screen Space Ambient Occlusion (SSAO) would be a nice addition.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screen_Space_Ambient_Occlusion

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4259709/rFactor/rFactor-2010-02-18-15-07-51.gif

Give it a while to load, then it starts flicking between with/without ambient occulsion+DoF

@ TheWhiners

Would you guys rather us not put any previews out ? Any of you crying about graphics or our camera, etc.. Grow up.. geez..

If I could have done it my way, and we were set up to do just that.. Fraps would have been running on MY gaming PC and I would have captured tons of 1080 screens and direct footage from in game..

Gjon wouldn’t allow it.. so this is all you get for now. I can just about bet money that Gjon will let us have some in game captures when he’s more prepared to do so.

Should I hold off on releasing the live action footage since “it’s only a lap top running on a TV” ? or not “720P” LOL ?

Maybe I should so that all the people that appreciate the news we’re releasing, can go after all the whiners and shut them up once and for all..
;-) (like that’ll ever happen) Just like back in school or the military.. One person makes a mistake and everyone has to pay the price.

Darin Gangi
Inside Sim Racing
RSC Reporter

Uff:
I think that nobody’s asking for Grid or Dirt graphics here (also because they’re full of overexaggerated effects which make those games far away from being realistic): we’re just hoping for something that would help in recreate real life experience, just like a good light system, proper reflections and so on. Those things can be achieved even with Dx9.

I’d take Grid’s graphics with bloom disabled. When you disable that it really is a fantastic looking game. Physics? Well I heard it had some at least… that’s about it :D

With the NFS Shift or Ricer Driver Grid you can race onlinee whit 64-players, multiclass cars and big tracks like Nürburgring?
The use of PC resources in a simulator is different from a ARCADE and I hope the rFactor 2 takes the example of iRacing, the graphics are “simple” but definitely is the game to looks more real.

@DeadStar:

I am amazed by the quality of your argument about the importance of graphics in a simulation. There is nothing left to say, you said it all, Sir.

Anyway, I think rF2 won’t disappoint us gfx-wise, it’s bound to be an improvement on rF1 from the looks of the screenies, and it will do nothing but improve in the coming months until the first release.

I’d rather have ISI put more time into improving FF and nailing down a waterproof sim engine for all kinds of mods, the rest can and probably will come later in an update of sorts.

What would you be willing to spend on rF2? Does 100€ sound reasonable? Given the joy rF1 has given me for 40€ or so, I’d be more than happy to spend 100€ or more on a base release + updates.

Hoover

David Wright: The thing with graphics is its easy to take them for granted and think they don’t matter.Try installing ISIs original Sports Car GT or even F1-2000 and you will realise just how far we have come in terms of graphics.I really don’t think most simmers could live with SCGT graphics even with iRacing physics.

I think context is important – when someone says “I don’t care about graphics” I suspect what they mean is, “I don’t need the most cutting edge 2012 era graphics that push the system so far 80% won’t be able to run hardware to support it for 3 more years”. We *expect* at least what we have now, with a measure of improvement to work acceptably with modern hardware.

I’d be shocked if anyone saying graphics isn’t important want the status quo, or worse, SCGT level, they’re actually the rational folks who can tell the images posted *do not* reflect what is likely to be in the sim. They’re also probably the folks who won’t drive GT4/Forsa over iRacing because of some photorealistic effect – but inferior physics and racing; they’re folks who would give up lens flare for (example) an accurate transmission in the historic GP cars (not that both are actually coded by the same guys).

@Darin: Please ignore the whiners and keep the news coming. There will *always* be folks who have a bone to pick with any title out there, but the majority here appreciate the hard work you guys are putting into keeping us up to date simracing wise.

All the best,

hoover

ISRacing: @ TheWhinersWould you guys rather us not put any previews out ?Any of you crying about graphics or our camera, etc.. Grow up.. geez..
If I could have done it my way, and we were set up to do just that.. Fraps would have been running on MY gaming PC and I would have captured tons of 1080 screens and direct footage from in game..
Gjon wouldn’t allow it.. so this is all you get for now. I can just about bet money that Gjon will let us have some in game captures when he’s more prepared to do so.
Should I hold off on releasing the live action footage since “it’s only a lap top running on a TV” ? or not “720P” LOL ?Maybe I should so that all the people that appreciate the news we’re releasing, can go after all the whiners and shut them up once and for all..
;-) (like that’ll ever happen) Just like back in school or the military.. One person makes a mistake and everyone has to pay the price.Darin Gangi
Inside Sim Racing
RSC Reporter

You’re a funny boy.

I dont understand why Gjon choose this way of promoting rFactor 2

I dont give a fuck that your camera sux and that you took pictures and that you decided to upload it.

Keep the live footage to yourself, 320×240 footage aint my thing…

GeraArg:
The use of PC resources in a simulator is different from a ARCADE and I hope the rFactor 2 takes the example of iRacing, the graphics are “simple” but definitely is the game to looks more real.

agree with that! I was amazed how iracing takes less resources than rfactor mods I’m used to play and the graphics still looks in par with those mods!

Shum94: You’re a funny boy.I dont understand why Gjon choose this way of promoting rFactor 2I dont give a fuck that your camera sux and that you took pictures and that you decided to upload it.Keep the live footage to yourself, 320×240 footage aint my thing…

You’re a funny boy.

It wasn’t planned to show the guys of SRT any preview material. So this is just a great surprise for us all. It are not officialy released previews what so ever. So just shup up and be pleased with the fact there’s at least SOMETHING to enjoy.

Well said, Darin!

You mean they bump each other doing the groceries then they engage conversation then they managed to spyshot rFactor 2

Fuck ! You’re A FUNNY BOY

SHum94, you’re so incredibly ungrateful, people like you make me dispair
You’re trolling the topic, after Darin has already warned people like you? I doubt people will be best pleased if you’re one of the reasons the SRT don’t give us any more material. Not that you’d be bothered.
.

guys, don’t feed the trolls. If you ignore them (I know it’s difficult), they’ll return to their beloved xbox / playstation forums soon enough.

\|||/
(o o)
,~~~ooO~~(_)~~~~~~~~~,
| Please |
| don’t feed the |
| TROLL! |
‘~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ooO~~~’
|__|__|
|| ||
ooO Ooo

Let’s see if wp does html tags, otherwise the above sign will come out a bit
distorted … ;-)

Shum94: You mean they bump each other doing the groceries then they engage conversation then they managed to spyshot rFactor 2Fuck ! You’re A FUNNY BOY

Yes.

Heh, sorry My ability to just let trolls slip by me isn’t that good, I always feel the need to say at least something. :C

One kid saying he wont publish his previews
Others kids saying i am a kid trolling ^^

My sentiment was i regret how ISI choose to show their work.

The whiner is the kid threatning to not release his preview.

please continue

If it wasn’t for ‘the whiner ‘ there wouldn’t be anything for you to complain about :) .
I do understand your reaction though. We all want the best possible previews, but I’d rather have these video snapshots than photoshopped screenies and hyped-up videos. It’s a bit of give and take between the developers who don’t want to disappoint and the gamers who want to know every detail. ISI are doing a pretty decent job at that I would think, by releasing the info they want to release, without trying to make everyone dream of the perfect sim.

Looking forward to the interview and the moving pictures …

Sommergemüse: I repost from other rf2 Article:Sorry but the graphics are REALLY outdated… Looks 99% like rFactor 1…The Cockpits are ugly compared to Shifts/Ferrari Project one (there was a very similar Single Seater) …If they could build in Reflections and nice dynamic Light/Shadows – rFactor 2 would look awesome…

i’l take a pic on my mobile phones camera of nfs shift and i be 100% certain it will look just as good as those screen shots above.

seriously, go away and play f1 2010 if all you care about is graphics.

Joney, you got ‘ninjaed’ by Ermax, yesterday

jonneymendoza:
i’l take a pic on my mobile phones camera of nfs shift and i be 100% certain it will look just as good as those screen shots above.seriously, go away and play f1 2010 if all you care about is graphics.

Someone Posted a little picture with “bad” image editing and looks better than these.

And I don’t care all about Graphics!!! But Graphics are very Important. If you mean it’s a Simulation and Graphics are indifferent – that’S simply wrong.

I want you guys ask: Why can’t you use arguments – and not always Offense me (which I don’T care BTW – a funny guy sent me many hate mails)

And BTW I hate GRID, F1 2010 Graphics the Bloom and Color Overlay are very ugly. Shift Graphics are very nice – even without Bloom or HDR!

Reason: Nice Reflections and Lightning. This are the two wishes for me for rFactor 2..

Hehe, someone sent you hate mail because of comments here?

Yep crazy peoples …

Well, i’m not an expert but..with the actual technology (and pc power)probably you can create a sim with an excellent graphic, an excellent physics engine and..and excellent sound engine. Every software house do choices, based to marketing research and..budget cost.

People tend to talk a lot about “ engines” : graphics engine, etc. , while those so called new engines are probably 50% is an advertisement trick and 50 % is a simple evolution by additing a few features.

What make graphics good is probably mostly not an “engine” but rather a well done art and right decisions in choosing priorities, an ability to sift out things in search for something more visually expressive. Some rF mods demonstrate it quite well.

When I hear about “new engine” I rather expect something blurry and smeared, post-processed to death, highly over-contrasted and brown colored for better matching comics illustrations with an only purpose to hide how ugly everything actually are.

I believe they already did a good engine. Now they need to do something good with it.

well well days have changed haven’t day gone are the days when a pc gamer would be satisfied with any graphics as long as the physics were there. We have to blame PD for doing with GT5 what they’re and what about the 360 talk?? xbox games are all 560p that’s not even HD crap graphics!

yes PD should sell their gt5 gfx engine to PC developers so they can see what can really be done with more then 256 mb of v/ram

Wow.
Let me quote Mr. Croshaw here:
“Fans are clingy complaining dipshits who will never ever be grateful for any concession you make. The moment you shut out their shrill, tremulous voices the happier you will be for it.”
There.
If I were from ISI and was reading this page I’d never EVER show any sneak peeks of ANY work from now on.
This is getting worse that what’s going on on car forums. I’m almost starting to be grateful that I have a lot less free time to simrace.

I think rfactor2 will bring some noticeable improvements. It has a huge community, so surely ISI won’t disappoint them.

I hope it will be released this year

Jos: yes PD should sell their gt5 gfx engine to PC developers so they can see what can really be done with more then 256 mb of v/ram

This shows how ignorant people are towards the PS3 as the programing is completely different from pc. the Cell processor is what is used for gfx with its 7 SPUs!

Sommergemüse:
Shift Graphics are very nice – even without Bloom or HDR!
Reason: Nice Reflections and Lightning. This are the two wishes for me for rFactor 2..

fair comment .

Hey, Felipe, please keep you GT5 preaching out of at least one thread. Please.