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Working qualifying and sane saving/loading of setups are a must. Only when those 2 are done I will spend more time with pCars.
Any M3 sounds good, 2x M3 even better :p

Pity it’s too much CPU intensive. It’s far from fluid with my C2D at 3.8GHz and a GTX660… :(

I can run all other sims rF2, RaceRoom, iRacing, but this one just runs bad, even with 60FPS it feels choppy… :(

Well, seeing how Loire basically doesn’t exist, guess the E30 is the only thing worth following here for me.

If only pCARS had an idea as to what it wanted to be. And no, I’m not talking about how the cars feel like boats. Haters below.

Really looking forward to the removal of the 30s replay limit in Practice.
Also the split times popping up in the middle of the screen. It doesn’t seem right for a sim to have things popping up on screen while you’re driving. Maybe the customisable HUD’s will sort that out.

Your cpu is getting old. A fast quad core is needed these days. Time for an upgrade i say. Your 660 is being held back a lot by your C2D too.

same here, 40-60fps with phenom x4 and 6970. I’m trying to ignore fps and waiting for the new intel processors release next summer.

I’d have to agree with Mike on this one. Those of you who build your own computers need to know what a bottleneck is. I mean no offense by that, but there are many people that just don’t know why they don’t get great performance and many times it’s because of a bottleneck.

For example, you wouldn’t put racing fuel in a Toyota Prius. The Prius is a bottleneck. In order for the racing fuel to do it’s job, the engine has to be built to take advantage of that fuel.

Same goes for computers. An old, outdated CPU+Motherboard (Prius) with a new graphics card (racing fuel) isn’t going to cut it. You’re Prius (CPU+Motherboard) is a bottleneck. It’s not allowing the racing fuel (graphics card) to perform at it’s full potential.

Slightly mad is working very hard on this title, proven by the screen shots by their members?!? Fanboys below

No, proven by the daily (!) build changelogs :)

Somehow I love the advertisement on these things; ‘Marvelous Stew’, ‘Doors8′, ‘Lobster energy’

So what you’re saying is that they’re working too hard to have time to take their own promo shots?

This appears to be the most visually apealing racing game I’ve ever seen. But I keep hearing bad things about it’s physics, which is a buzzkill. When this is finished, do you think it will be as realistic as rFactor 2 seems to be?

Trolololol

SMS say they want it to be, and the physics team seems to have the talent to do so. There’s some interesting and useful advice coming in from the handling consultants so we’ll see how it progresses.

The game always had the problem that the movement of the cars feel like their being controlled by a box or something that desperatly wants to move the car in a unnatural way in way or the other.

You can see this effect when driving with the t-cam, especially on bumps/curbs the cars movement feels and looks very odd.

Graphics are nice but you won’t notice them when really racing and trying to do one lap to another in full concentration. Even with the current builds I’m still more busy trying to figure out what crazy movements the cars are going to do in / out of a corner instead of being able to put in some decent laps.

This, for me, takes out the fun part of a (sim)racing game. It doesn’t feel consistent at all (and yes I know 95% of the cars are still WIP). The older Simbin titles for example (GTR2, Race07 + expansions) might not have the best and immersive physics, but they do have a believable form of driving consistency between their various cars. Therefore I don’t understand people shouting how awsome this game is, yes it has potential, but theirs more to a racing game then just some nice pictures.

I hope they can try to turn the handling side around in the next couple of months instead of keeping it pointed towards a F1 2012/GRID/GT5/Forza audience as the current builds are simply undriveable for me.

sarcasm?

Is there a way to get a sim game realistic ? I don’t think so. No one is realistic. If it will be authentic ? Yes !
Physic is WIP as the whole game as well. Ask again when the developement is near finished. I have no doubts it will be very authentic.

2012 most overated game

why they slowed down updates? we had a weekly builds for team members and now they out more often

“Is there a way to get a sim game realistic ?” Yes, the games are simulating real world physics, if a simulated car can accelerate from 0-60 in 3.5seconds and pull 2G in a corner, and ride bumps without flipping or spinning out, like the real car, then that is simulating real world physics. Heck, P&G3 does a good job, with the best physics in a game yet, in that spins are recoverable, or you can even hold a drift, unlike in most sims, but much like real life.

Authentic? in terms of physics? No, the game can not be authentic, it is an impossibility by definition, it is not real, original or true, it is a simulation of real world physics in a game.

Ok than i’m mixing up something. That sounds plausible. Does that mean when we talk about any virtual simulation that it is called realistic the more accurate it is ? I have read it all the time the other way around and use it also as definition and nobody has correct or teach me the right definition. Btw thank you.

Grammar police: Overrated
I love the same cookie cutter responses to every pcars news item. While i agree with some of it, its getting a bit parrot like. Im going to go bang my head on a wall now.

The graphic is amazing but without good physics will be 0 game,sms promissed good physics if they failed they will shoot themself.Only proper physics till now is in rfactor and rbr,then gtr2 have acceptably physics.Race07 and others simbin products are far away from these 3 games

If sms failed that will be very bad for sim community,but then rf2 will explain to them why rfactor community is so strong

yours is probably more of an optimization problem than a CPU one (not to say changing CPU won’t bring any advantage), pcars seems to “hate” AMD’s but they’re going to work on this before release

I’m a team member since the beginning, but i don’t play the updates anymore. The way they’ve chosed (sluggish arcade) it’s not for me, i don’t feel any connection with that physic, using a G27. For sure i’ll take a look soon, but i don’t expect something different.

As long as SMS doesn’t solve the most noticeable flaws in the game you’ll keep hearing the same perspective from a simracers’ point of view…..

SMS have choosen (at least for now) that overall graphical quality and iterative content releases based on placeholders is the way too go to keep the “mass” (literally) happy.

For me their saying, here you have a new car that looks like a , but it’s useless untill we decide we do something on the placeholder physics.

I would prefer the release cycle that rF2 / R3E are using. Limited content but with higher overall quality which is actually driveable and fun!

Maybe I’m just not suited for participating in the agile approach that they use in releasing their content.

And hopefully we will see an iRacing delta bar for pCARS as SMS doesn’t want to copy this thing for their game.

Real racing drivers disapprove.

I think the issue is that authentic is used out of context, I understand the intention by its usage, but I think its real use would not allow for the possibility of simulation, authentic must be real. Though it could be used if say, you were in an actual simulator, hydraulic lifts, real cockpit, and true to life physics, photorealistic graphics, so it is an actual representation of the look and feel of racing a real car. I went in a V8 Supercar simulation that was doing the rounds in NZ several years ago, unfortunately it was just rfactor on a giant screen in front of the car, with no hydraulics, good effect and good fun, but by no means authentic.
In our case, all we can do is have our G27s, powerful computer, maybe triple screen, sitting in our office chairs trying to be immersed in a racing simulation that attempts to mimic real world physics.

In terms of handling, Netkar Pro is the best without doubt.

The schedule has always been weekly team member builds, however when multiplayer was first introduced everyone got temporary access to daily builds to ensure that multiplayer fixes went out to everyone immediately. Now that the MP code has stabilised, they can just put all multiplayer fixes into the weekly builds.

what you mean??? that Richard Burns is not real driver and that he did not participate in making of RBR,for rf i have no comment

The movie industry is using it if a artist is able to mim ( mimic ) a character if i’m not wrong and call it authentic. I think you are right. In the context of simulation there is a long way to go until it is authentic.

They can’t afford rF2 or R3E release cycle because their financial model would collapse. Many people (including me) bought in mainly because there is ability to play new builds every week.

Nope, realism.

Extensive audio improvement ……

Well, iRacing has about 30,000 paying a subscription fee to play a work in progress ;)

Current SimBin isn’t that far from GTR2. Just when you compare the GTs Race (Add-Ons) feel weird, and they are completely different set-ups anyway (endurance – sprint)

Not sure if I count as a “real driver” though :D

I personally like the split times and I don’t care about replays in any way… Talk about opposite ends of the spectrum! ;) I think this is one of the biggest challenges for pCARS (and all SW, really): how do you make everyone happy? Customization is great, but at some point everyone may have to learn programming just to utilize all the settings. :P

“SMS have choosen (at least for now) that overall graphical quality and
iterative content releases based on placeholders is the way too go to
keep the “mass” (literally) happy.”

Where do people come up with this stuff? Where has SMS ever said they chose to focus on the graphics? If the graphics are ahead of the physics, so what? One does not preclude the other in development. It is what is in the finished game that matters (even though I am happy driving a couple nights a week as it currently stands).

You are not completely right. pCARS is unnecessarily CPU intensive, even with 0 AI it’s very bad…

In many other games my CPU is NOT a bottleneck for the GTX660 at max settings…

I wait for Ivy Bridge-E

I’m waiting too and for the moment my solution is launching rF2 instead of pCARS…

It’s more of a personal view then an official statement of SMS :). I’ll give it another try when they’re at build 5xx or so, I might sound quite negative in my posts but I think it’s just a shame… we’d all love to have a game with the pCars graphics and some decent physics because you know it’s possible when comparing it to the other sims out there (physics wise, fired up nkPro this evening, still one of the best….) and they’re (not yet) delivering on that aspect.
First world problems I guess :)
.

Ben Collins give feedbacks using driving aids and Nicolas Hamilton using a gamepad. Very promissing :(

I think you missed the point.

The point is that you should know that even though certain games run perfectly fine with older hardware, that doesn’t mean that your CPU/motherboard isn’t bottlenecking your system.

I’m not pointing fingers, or playing the blame game here. So don’t take this personally. I’m merely pointing out that when you place a newer generation graphics card into an older generation motherboard coupled with older CPU technology, there’s a bottleneck there, whether you see it in certain games or not.

It’s just reality. Any computer technician will tell you the same thing.

I’m not saying there aren’t problems with PCars. There are MANY issues with that Sim. But you have to remember, that Sim is still in beta. It’s not finished. You kinda have to give it some slack.

I’m not saying that split times shouldn’t be there, because they very much should. But as a sim-racer I don’t want them popping up in the middle of my screen like I’ve just collected a bonus. It just doesn’t seem sim-like.
Having it as part of the HUD like most other sims is maybe a tradition that should be stuck to.

Not caring about the replays means that you won’t really mind if the replay limit is lengthened as it won’t affect you. But for those that maybe like to make a video now and again, it’s nice to have more than 30s to do it with.

As you know this, I am pretty sure you also know Nicolas Hamilton’s wheel gets not correctly recognized by the game and Ben Collins forget to turn them off. You know, that happens if you jump between cars. His words about driving behaviour is nevertheless more valid WITH assists than 99,9% of the sim racing communities’s believings. But keep trying.

IMO the cars are quite drivable and getting real close to top notch. For the most part most of the cars handle really well. I think there are a couple of areas that can be improved upon to increase the amount of finesse one must put in to drive the cars at speed but I see most of it being petty good

Net Kar Pro is really good yes

Okay I’ll say it Pre-Alpha not beta yet. yes I know you all have heard this before.

I have been hammering in the forums that this title has to be for everyone at all levels or else I see it as a fail this means the Hard Core people all the way down to the beginners. I think the physics side of the madness engine has come a long way and ATM something that is very workable just depends what direction it is taken in and that may mean many directions to suit the most amount of people possible. I don’t use replay to make my judgements and reserve that for on the track and all I can say is it is getting there. People commenting that they have not played this in quite some time really don’t have a pot to piss in because they could just as easily be giving constructive criticism in the forums to help get this title to be something they want! Rather than exerting energy in this forum to trash it.

I respect people who put in there time posting laps and then trying to do there best to help make this title the best it can be. How do you really know what the game is like at this point in time if you don’t play it?

I have nothing against you, but I know what a bottleneck is and how to choose components and build a PC. I do it myself and I have an engineering degree…
In some games, with all options maxed out, there is no CPU bottleneck but a GPU bottleneck. Buying this GTX660 was a nice upgrade from my previous graphic cards for only 175 €. It would have costed me a lot more to upgrade my all system, but anyway I will do it later when new Ivy Bridge CPU are available for LGA2011 socket.

I wish people would say AT LEAST which car they’re talking about.

They all are at very different levels of development, especially after the new tyre model.

Many of the cars have quite bad default setups right now because the tyres they got change alot anyway. Once you put some time in it to set them up to your driving style many ( definately not all ) are pretty much up there with the rest of the top sims. This sort of stuff is to be expected during development of a tyre model.

FFB is a different topic of course. It got stripped of effects and is unbalanced for now making it all feel less connected of course. If you ignore that and look at what the cars are doing it looks very believable.

This comes from someone driving alot of rF2 lately also. Usually the IsR Servers clios or,megane ( seem to be the most crowded servers ).

My eyes and my brain are arguing over if the first screenshot is real or not… Even after looking at it for a while its so close to real that you get confused by looking at it! :)

I’m not sure if its only me, but when im driving it does look very good but not THIS good…

I’m driving the R3E Beta and to me when driving its almost par with pCars, though in the screenshots its night and day…

I’ll tell you where the problem lies for Slightly Mad Studios with this never touching a sim as other PC online sims can easily call themselves sim. One sentence. Flame me as much as you want, but I agree with every statement Jeroen said. Here’s why as well: “Because this is a multiplat that will even come out on the Nintendo system.” I’m sorry. Being a multiplat title once again makes for nothing more then a money grab. SMS need to choose a platform and develop strictly for it.

The PC title may be on it’s own in some areas, but lets not fool ourselves that physics takes up a lot of the memory on consoles and so SMS have to dumb it down, and all platforms will be integrated into one when it comes to the coding. I’ll hear fanboys scoff at this, but don’t fool yourselves. Way over a year and this ntm is still just aweful. The Ford GT is garbage to drive. That car may not have sat as low as todays aerodynamic cars, but just watch the start of the race of the Steve McQueen movie Lemans. Even tho that was a 1971/72 time framed lemans, the cars performed very close to the Ford GT. They drove em on the edge. Ford GT in Cars drives like a cadillac. It’s just insanely poor.

They can hire the drivers. They hired the corvette driver in the American LeMans series for Shift 2 and we know how junk that game was to drive. I’m seeing a rehash once again. Very disappointed. Thank God for Asseto Corsa, and simbins title and rF2. Take your photo graphics and run. Cause that’s all your gonna be able to brag about. Give me the physics and GOOD graphics and i’ll shut my mouth.

Sometimes it’s best to do your homework and learn what a true sim is and why we don’t call this a sim. Not trying to start up something or smear you. Just many let their sensitive side interfere with the truth of the matter. Best you understand what makes a sim a sim and what makes hype hype. Doesn’t matter to any of us what anyone says and you can argue and argue till your head turns blue. no matter.

When you involve yourself in hardcore sims where tuning and using a wheel are main priorities, these NFS Shifts, and all these drop dead gorgous titles mean very little to the sim racing fan. Give me decent graphics and killer physics and once again, i’m all over the title. Remember Cars and Asseto Corsa are the only GT5 looking sims out there. And iRacing, rF2, Simbins upcoming title, and GSC2012 look amazing on my 2560 x 1440 27″ monitor both inside the cockpit and watching the spectator view replays.

So if Cars doesn’t deliver physics, I won’t grovel. i’m out.

Well Jeroen. I’m confident Asseto Corsa will give you the full package unlike what i’m seeing with CARS. Wanna know something crazy when it comes to cutting corners. I want you if you own it to put shift 2 into play and watch the main spectator camera angles and viewpoints on Shift 2 and then fire up Cars. You will see the exact same camera angles and incar cockpit shots on the replay in the exact same places. Talk about cookie cutting the title to look and feel the same when watching replays.

I noticed that on Spa, nordeshleife, and some others that are in both games. They can’t even make the replay angles different. Not good to me. I’m not gonna say any more. Gonna start World war 3 and I don’t want it. Just my observations and opinion on a game not yet to be called a sim.

LOL You missed to read the article, don´t you?

What did you expect to get within the development? Of course they are running a lot of stuff from a previous, “working” game until they have something new to replace it.

Better to have placeholders in some situations than nothing.

“i’m out.”
——————————————————————————-
And please, don´t come back.

You own this site? NO? K. We don’t need to hear comments like that. Obviously your sensitivity has far outweighed your common courtesy.

I’ll give you a compliment. Out of any CARS fanboy, YOU are the most sensitive. Just saying. don’t know much about you other then you trash anyones opinion when it comes to being negative about PCARS. You’re not hurting me or anyone, but yourself. take care.

I’ve tried both the BMW’s and the DTM car…. Might wanna try the classic Lotus F1 cars but those we’re (in previous builds) just a joke, it’s more like driving a modern prototype then an F1 car with huge amounts of power and limited downforce.

Does SMS have a schedule on which cars they’re gonna work? Or is it a random pick each week? :) (just trolling hehe)

I’m not actively following the development and / or giving feedback in their forums….. got just enough time to drive a couple sims once in a while, just stating my opinion with my experience with this project thus far.

I’ll hope they’ll make it a good sim in the remaining development time. I think it’s good for the growth of the simracing community if we have several titles we can promote to the more serious racing gamers.

Simply exemplary for WMD community’s fakes.

If you would take your time reading the forum instead writing nonsense on virtualr.net, you would know where the list is and what the progress of every car is.

Lol I guess my common courtesy is far better than yours since I wasn’t banned for destructive behavior. And it isn’t surprising to see you celebrating your comeback in the pCars-news draining off the same stuff like before.

May I being biased towards pCars, my advantage compared to you is still that I don’t need to tear my mouth about the other sims but taking all sims the same way. Other than you hanging around in pCars articles trying to make others believe how bad pCars is like it is an universal truth.

Not so sure about that.
Driving aids in all sims work totally different than in real cars, they are too effective. For example ABS in real world is useless on snow or mud, in sims ABS always works perfectly, traction control can basically remove any under/oversteer feel from the car so I’m not sure how reliable judging car’s behavior with aids can be.

Lol, who the f#!+ do you think you are? I said nothing about pcars and it being a sim or not. I said i tire of the same old discussion. I would imagine i have more sim racing experience than you do. You best learn to reply to a comment with something that pertains to the comment posted. I never once said pcars is a sim tho, so dont know what you are smoking.

Relax, I am talking and answering to hoodge. The comments are just not connected correctly via the software which takes a while.

And what do you think how much impressed I am about your racing experience? Or better said: why are you assuming that you have more experience than me? ;)

Ron you simply missed the ending sentence: “…not YET to be called a sim.” Read the full comment.

No one has the advantage over a persons personal opinion and that goes for me over yours. Good morning and good day sir.

I love how peoples opinions just turn a opinion discussion into a battleground with some individuals on here. Shows the strong and the weak minded. I’m calm and cool about anything said. But you Ron are famous for being a all time CARS cop and remember friend, their are potential customers and onlookers reading these threads and Personally YOU are not serving SMS well at all in the confidence area and even being in the Marketing area of a future title to come out.

YOU trash on anyone practically who verses thier opinions and you need to control your emotions and take the positive with the negative. Otherwise SMS would do you well to ask you to muzzle it. No predictions are set in stone by me or anyone. I could be wrong in the end. You deal with your behavior. Opinions and mixed feelings will be around always. Know it.

As pCARS doesn’t have snow and mud the ABS issue won’t be that much of a big deal then. Doesn’t affect car behaviour until you brake either.
I wish we could use the word assists instead of aids. I’m not politically correct but the phrase ‘judging cars behaviour with aids’, for a moment, conjoured up a different image to what you meant.

What did I say Nathan that upset you so much?

I don’t understand posts like this.
You have the game, have paid to be a member, then don’t download the weekly updates. How out of date are you? When was your last update? A lot has changed and you might be surprised at the advances made since your last update. Maybe not. But it costs you nothing to try.
If you already expect nothing to be different, then you may be going in without an open mind. Still, I hope you find things have improved to some degree.
Get up to date, then judge it. Thats a lot fairer.

Not sure how you can blanket claim that rfactor 1 has proper physics.
I know loads of mods made for rfactor 1 who’s physics don’t even touch those of RACE07.

rFactor’s physics are only as good as the mod you’re playing and how well the modder got it to feel right. Unless you’re referring to it’s stock content which I doubt you are.
As for RBR, I’m not a fan. I don’t think the physics compensate for the fact you can’t feel any car movement while sat at home. At least that’s how I see it.
And if the stock physics are all that, why has RBRSR (?) mod needed to change them ? Maybe they (think they) know better.

Its just a shame about the rest of it. Hopefully AC will fix most of that.
NKP is held in popular belief to be the best but I`d feel a lot more confident of that claim if it was coming from people who drove the actual cars.

pCARS already has physics. But when will it become a sim in your eyes ?
I mean, when you say “what makes a sim a sim”, can you at least let us know what you think that is. What does make a sim a sim ?
Whatever your answer, I wonder if it will be the same for everyone.
‘Believable physics’ won’t cut it though. First, thats obvious and 2nd everyone has a different version of what they deem to be believable.

Before SMS muzzle me, they will ban you for sure. Don´t expect me to care about your advices of me being gentle, cool or controlling my emotions. Same counts for you being well known as an active (SMS) pCARS hater, active in every pCARS article tearing your mouth about it (when you are not banned for a while).

And as I said (and you can check it out). I mostly reply to you (and your kind), coming along with empty allegations. If people argue negative things with convincing points, I am on their side. But you, for sure, are none of them.

just to tell you.. physics will be different between PC and console version due to the weaker console’s CPUs: on PC we’ll have a more detailed tire model, a dynamic tire carcass and devs are thinking about a new multibody solver for chassis torsion

Im not talking about any mods,i talk about games from stores without no mods.RSBR is also mod,try rbr few days and you will see why that ugly graphic still have tons of fans.And its only game that you exactly can feel real behavior of the car,its even better than rf

Sorry, what? The game not being 100% finished at pre-alpha stages is ‘cutting corners’ now? I suppose we’re going to start attacking ISI and Kunos now because their games aren’t finished either? ‘Look at those lazy people at Kunos, they can’t even give us a drivable demo yet.’ Oh right, that’s because their game is still in development too.

Not to mention that Shift 1 and 2 already showed that the PC builds of the engine are different to consoles. I don’t think our comments will matter though, I believe this is the same chap who wilfully ignores any positive news about pCARS in order to keep ranting.

He conveniently overlooks that other sims have been ported to consoles too, such as RBR and F1C. ‘Warthog needed to choose a platform and develop strictly for it, RBR was nothing more than a money grab.’

I think you missed my point regarding options… Sure, we can add ‘switches’ for every feature, but at some point it is going to get unwieldy. :)

You mean that Ben Collins set a single laptime on the leaderboards with assists on, which he has since bettered without them.

His actual feedback frequently covers how and when the front wheels lock up under braking, so for obvious reasons he can’t be using ABS to give his feedback.

Telling me to do my homework and understand what makes a sim a sim as if you are some kind of expert is what sets me off. The post of mine that you replied to said nothing of pcars being a sim so i dont know why that long winded post of “sim this” and “not sim that” was needed. Ive been at this long enough to know what i like to race for leagues and what i like to race for fun. Rfactor is still my go to sim for organized league events but that doesnt mean i wouldnt run pcars or AC in leagues when they come out. AC is shaping up nicely but will still be missing some of the variables that make a racing event for me, like dynamic weather and time of day stuff. While i would prefer a car to feel believable, i also want that race weekend feel that most sims have yet to deliver. I think pcars can do that.

now, that reminds me that the guy that did the “arcade-called” BTM was the same that did RBR physics, i think the problem with pCARS is that it came out with too much placeholder physics and now it had built up the “identical to shift 2″ fame between simracers. For example i’ve to say that initially R3E physics felt to me MUCH worse tha pCARS’s, now it got better (still weird while braking, at least IMHO), but still my feel is that if it was pCARS with that physics everyone was going to shout ARCADE everywhere, but because it was their beloved SimBin nobody did that.
I could be totally wrong, but my feel is that if those who criticize it would spend some more time playing it and watching it going better from build to build, they’ll probably change some of their opinions

You may be calm and cool but you are very condescending and come off as a know it all. This kind of style will inflame certain types of people. I wouldnt call them or myself sensitive tho. Im just not going to be told how things are by people. I live by my own thoughts and opinions on things and clearly what one person believes to be a sim is different from another. Some people just want the car simulated and will be happy with that. Others want the whole racing experience simulated. I want pit crews in their boxes acting life like. I want to see them running around my car during a stop. I want to see marshalls reacting to accidents and fans on the fences. Just running a car around bland environments does not make me feel like a race car driver so i dont feel the whole experience is simulated. I want immersion and simuation combined.

That’s what i’ve done for almost an year, since the beginning. I felt the physic/ffb moving to what is one week ago. (my build is 382) and i don’t like it. I didn’t slammed the door anyway. It’s matter of tastes. What about my mind approach?. I didn’t know you, never worked together (i think). Maybe you should ask to Monsum, T-Spark or Nugit, Madhorse if Elwood if i’m a closed mind or not. (it’s my nick). All people that i’ve the pleasure to work with. Cheers.

Well that is just your opinion. Stating what is better than what will always be opinion.
I doubt that sitting on a static chair at home you can feel the real behaviour of any car in any sim. All you have is visual/audio cues and force feedback.
I have not mentioned anything about graphics, ugly or otherwise, but I agree you don’t need top end graphics to enjoy a game.

You were not just talking about games from stores because you brought up rFactor 1. So unless you are referring to it with it’s stock content, you must be referring to the mods.

These Pcars threads are 100% entertainment. lmao …if a little repetitive

“I’ll tell you where the problem lies for Slightly Mad Studios with this never touching a sim as other PC online sims can easily call themselves sim.”

I’m sure SMS would like to hire you, so that they may bask in your wisdom.

“Here’s why as well: “Because this is a multiplat that will even come out on the Nintendo system.” I’m sorry.”

That’s utter rubbish for more reasons than I care to mention. And you’re most certainly not sorry.

“Give me the physics and GOOD graphics and i’ll shut my mouth.”

There is physics and there is GOOD graphics. Now will you shut your mouth and spare us your repetitive pettiness.

Gamers are smart and being a PC gamer in the sim niche we always want as much control of our game as possible. As F1Racer states all we need is a button in the option menu to click ON/OFF for such options. They can easily code that into the game. It is simply a matter of WMD having the will to do so.

I believe the sim makers are more realistic nowadays. While still trying to fulfill the needs of their niche traditional market (hardcore sim fan?) they realize that to be able to survive, they also have to attract more casual gamers (a much larger market) to buy their games without the games being too arcadie. I belive a beefed up driving assist should be able to “tame” the “realistic” physics so not to scare these casual gamers. If I’m correct even AC will include a drift game play that will use a “toned down” physics to attracts a more diversed car racing game fans aka to generate more income, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

I wasn’t saying you had a closed mind. Only that you said you didn’t update any more, without giving us and indication of when your last update was, and then were complaining that you didn’t like it.

It’s completely fair enough to say that if you have it up to date and fine that it isn’t going your way. Maybe it will improve to the point you will like it, but only you can decide if you want to give it that chance and allow yourself to keep up with the years development that still lies ahead.
Like you said, it’s all a matter of taste. Quite right.

RBR uses 1 car on track unlike many rally games at that time. So they got [i]all[/i] CPU power for physics and collisions. No way they could have run it with 6 cars afaik like some rally games did at that time, even as efficient as it was for its time.

F1C is completely different on consoles, there’s probably not a single line from ISI code in there unlike Shift which runs its unoptimized code for consoles on all platforms for AI and chassis.

Mainly because 95% of RSRBR are completely different cars then Vanilla RBR. I don’t think the “feel” really changed, the set-ups are a bit softer, and like is to expect many cars are a bit less powerful in terms of engine output.

rF mods, no mods, and other mods is like 3 different games / sims. Thankfully some of them are really good.

“in sims ABS always works perfectly”

I know what you mean but, in some sims you can set the ABS so that it still occasionally lock the wheels. or remove too much braking forces ( I think that’s the problem with current ABS systems? )

I doubt 100% realistic aids will make it more accepted by parts of the community though. I like how rFactor can give additional weight, and as far as I remember in some console games you get more points in career mode with less aids activated. At least that motivates people to switch them off more often, it’s not really fair in the end, because aids often don’t give you any advantages in terms of lap times.

I haven’t updated my RSRBR for a long while now, probably well over a year. I’m not against giving it another go, but I can’t say I’ve ever gelled with RBR. I did at the start when it came out I always thought the physics were maybe a bit too raw. Like maybe you could drive it better if sat in a full blown motion rig.

Dude Big Ron is a Highly Respected member of the Sim Race Community not just the WMD forums. Your not doing yourself any favors in the eyes of the Sim Race Community attacking Big Ron because he is one of the most well spoken members within it.

Yes its just my opinion,maybe we did not understand each other very well.For me RBR is best of the best sim game,you can’t feel g-forces at your home ,but behavior of the car is most natural of all sim games

About rfactor physics,i say that rbr and rf have best physics at this time,rf2 will have too,maybe you disagree with this,but never mind.

Btw If SMS failed with physics cars will go to oblivion very quickly

Actually I am not in complete disagreement. I think rF2′s physics are very much above the average. In fact only yesterday I was playing the Clio cars and thinking how great the feeling was from these front wheel drive cars.
As there are some superb mods on rF1, then rF1 I consider great too.
If SMS ‘fail’ with physics as you say, it will only be in the opinion of a few sim-racers and the result of that will not be a fading into oblivion. It also depends what you see as a failure. Clearly many people draw the line in different places.
If oblivion was the alternative then DIRT would be gone too because how do you compare DIRT’s physics to RBR ?

This is a public forum which entitles anyone to voice their opinions as long as you don’t break the guidelines. Your bud Little Ron is what I called him. LITTLE. So am I. He doesn’t own the site, nor do I. Get your thinking straight. Amazing how my truthful opinion on SMS’s cookie cutting the replays and the physics feeling like the road has magnets and the car has them attached to their underside like a AFX slotcar set makes for the car gripping rather unusual. Nothings gotten bettter but the cleaning up the shadows and long distance popup. FACT.

Truth hurts.

When the nurse tries to give me a shot the needle gets bent because I got that thick California Skin. Even with not having lived there in a while. So no your truth does not hurt. Ron has given a lot of time and effort to the industry as to help everybodies enjoyment of the genre. I for one respect Ron and people like him.
AFM no I am not a moderator and you can say what you want. You have to live with it not me I have my own convictions but coming from me Thanks Ron for your work added to P&G 3

Good for you. Smile and move on.

We talk about sim racing games,CARS should be another sim game. DIRT is ARCADE game,this is not place for that game,if you are sim racer your line is visible from far away.I was driving at 4-5 rfactor servers,for few times we drive gtr2 just to refresh ourselfs,and continue with rfactor.If you are hard core sim racer you would never ask about dirt and rbr physics.

If CARS fail they will not have place on sim racing sites,they will gone to oblivion for sure,if they cant create good physics its better for them to buy from ISI physics code and to implement in game,if this is possible,GTR2 under the hood have rfactor heart and its still playable today

Grab the popcorn!

Looks beautiful and *some* of the cars are becoming really enjoyable to use. Could maybe do with some tweaks here and there but physics is an impossible area to please everyone.

Oh there is so much I could come back with here :) But I will refrain from that otherwise this reply will be huge.
Anyway, I am not hardcore and I hope I never am labelled with such a term. What does it mean to be hardcore anyway ? What must you do to become hardcore where other sim-racers arent ?
CARS isn’t going into oblivion whether it meets your expectations or not. It may fade into your oblivion but I’m pretty confident it will be very much present. I have no idea what you mean about GTR2 having a rFactor heart. Or course it’s playable today, so is Pac-Man :) In fact why wouldn’t GTR2 not be playable ? The laws of physics never change so how good GTR2′s physics are will not change either, right ? Future games may get more sophisticed but GTR2 will remain what it always was. Hope that makes sense.
RBR is playable, GP4 is playable. It’s not a surprise to me.

When you are hard core sim racer you dont play shift,dirt, wrc,f1 race stars,grid,dirt,wrc powerslide etc..When you are sim racer you play rf1,rf2,netkar pro,rbr.iracing ,gtr2,gt legends and unfortunately this is all sim games,if i dont forgot something

About gtr2,open gtr folder and you will se that is no difference
between rf and gtr,it is same engine.Its playable because of good physics you understand me very well im glad of that

About CARS i wil try that game of course but if that game be like shift or other arcade soup,for 10 min will be uninstalled from pc

That description of hardcore, to me, is a total nonsense, as I thought it would be. So if I spend 25hrs a week playing iRacing or rFactor, but say 3 or 4 hours on DIRT then I am not labelled as hardcore in your opinion ?
Phew, then I was right. I don’t ever want to be labelled as hardcore. Its elitist and seems to set rules. That term seems to be invented by those who like to consider themselves as some step above other sim racers.
Oh and what happens if that sim racer deviates from a sim and plays 5 hours of GTA IV or COD ? Not hardcore anymore cos their time should be purely on sims ? It’s getting into the dictatorial arena of a religion now isn’t it ? :)

It would be a waste to uninstall a game after your massive 10 minute test after you have, hopefully, spent the money on it in the first place. But I suppose 10mins is plenty of time to form an non-objective view.

Thanks for your impressions. Others probably will enjoy sluggish arcade. If they wouldn’t have advertized it as a sim it would be a win win situation as it could broaden the interest in the racing genre in general.

Mate dont get me wrong,i cant play dirt and others arcade games,they are not interesting to me,believe me i know many sim racers who dont play arcades.Probably i dont know many sim racers who play arcade games,as you are.Nothing bad from me

If CARS have physics like flying carpet 10 min would be to much time from me,btw we are 2 mad mans:)),2 days of posting,bye mate

I don’t play those games either. I only stick to what the community defines as ‘sims’. But I do not in any way consider myself ‘hardcore’ any more than I consider myself a mad man.

They can pay me all they want to work for them if I was a CARS fanboy and i wouldn’t work for em. Not the product I would want to represent as a fan of PC sim racing. I love these bleeding comments with fans allowing themselves to get outright angry. Some of you owners of the WII U as well with it’s dismal promises of hype hype hype being nothing more then hot air and now even death threats are given in N4G “Wii U is dying and has a Dismal launch with very little games promised for the launch lineup” by rabid angry Nintendo fans. World War 3 over CARS and Nintendo. Funny how the truly passionate turn to children.

FACT.

I’m not angry, neither do I own any Nintendos. I just think your pettiness, repetitiveness and argumentation (or actually lack thereof) is pathetic.

If you’re so disappointed and angry with all things pCARS, why are you even here? I don’t get why some people hang out in discussions for things they dislike, red faced, typing away on hate postings…

Now, if only you’d keep good on your promise of shutting up :-))

I agree with you. Sound advice. You got it. Understand this. I’m not hating on it. I just simply voiced my opinion on a few areas that were not the most positive. Once again read my posts and observe no finger pointing or brow beating. I will always voice my opinions on a site that is open for discussion. Thanks.

It’s frikking embarrasing for the brand the way these “BMW”s drive now. I don’t see the point, if they are completely fubar just don’t release them yet. What the hell good does a pretty shell do? More pretty screenshots?

If you still have access to builds a car to try is the M3 just added. It may be more along the lines of what some of you are looking for.

It´s not your decision when SMS will release their new content. The community asked for them and they got them….point.

This is how games ‘develop’. You don’t just put a finished car in there. Thats DLC.

For the first time in about 4 months, I spent quite a bit of time in time trials, SP Races and Online racing.

My impressions:

1) Graphics are as usual excellent, but even set to heavy clouds there is always sun on track. Possibly not wholly developed yet?
But in the graphic department there is one thing that bugs me quite a bit. With the sun high in the sky, even on cloudy, the track looks washed out. With the sun low on the horizon the shadows on track seem to shimmer in an unpleasant way. Possibly my Vcard setup? This is a complaint I have had about pCARS since the very beginning.

2) Car Physics. Naturally, some cars are more developed than others. The Asano/Audi for instance drives very nicely as does the 70′s Lotus. The new BMWs need a good setup desperately and the E90 tends to snap oversteer very easily. In online racing I saw a lot of guys snap into the barriers on a slight oversteer.

3) Online racing: Considering how new it is, it is quite fun and very solid. Every 3 or 4 races I was chased by a flying guy on a racing seat but no car. A bit distracting.
The biggest issue in MP, which is also a big problem in SP Racing is the collision physics.
If two cars rub doors, they often get stuck and become joined until they crash. Far more annoying is the way even the slightest bump send cars flying all over the place. Especially in MP the collision physics should really be dialed so they allow some bumping and rubbing, otherwise even the most innocent contact results in 2 players being eliminated from the race if damage is turned on, or left far behind with damage off.
This is also a big issue in SP racing and since the AI is still very rudimentary makes offline racing very frustrating. The funniest episode in my session today was a race at Donington where I started last and every car in front of me rolled at T1. I ended up having top wait for those cars that managed to rejoin but for the remaining 5 laps there were cars driving all over the track, mostly off track.
In another race at SPA half of the AI got into a massive accident, with cars getting airborne all over the place. Once I was following 2 AI cars when the one behind barely touched the bumper of the other and both went flying upward and I drove right under them.

One last gripe is the “off track” warning. Especially in MP and time trials I like to have a sensitive warning system. It keeps folks honest and lap times realistic. But getting an entire lap at the ring disqualified because I went a bit too wide and put 2 wheels on the grass is excessive. I hope that in the future they’ll fine tune it for each track so that it is triggered only if the “off track” is of the time gaining kind.

I can’t say that but, when you drive it, inertias, braking, turning, feedback, grips, etc… are much more natural and smooth.
It’s difficult to master, you can fail and recover your car loosing time of course, but not loosing an entire race for a little mistake.
I don`t know if is the same as reality, but feels way better. And as I had read, some Abarth owners said that the game nails the physics of that car. Search for it.

You totally understand the WMD idea.

What!? Sensible critique – I’m confused now :-p

Some good points there. Luckily many of these things are trivial, like some of the online issues and the track warnings, and will be finished/fixed/polished as a matter of course. It would also be helpful if you post your impressions in the latest build thread; the devs and your fellow members will read it – we do like reasoned feedback :-)

For your lighting issue, have you tried other HDR modes, or simply HDR off?

Agreed. And I believe you about the Abarth, it is a great little car and feels very believable.

Damn right!

I decided to be a fan of Pcars a few months back because I thought the last 6 months would bring some real physics improvements, I wanted to stop bashing it and become a real fan. While, there have been some improvements yes, its still not even close to a real sim, still feels way too much like your every day racer game.

I still have hope though.

Yes, Big Ron lives on these forums. Anytime anyone says anything negative about PCars, regardless of wether its subjective or factual, Big ol Ron here has to go on an ultra defensive and insecure rage on downplaying or justifying any problems with PCars. Get a life, its just a video game. Oh wait its more, its an “Investment” lol, so thats why you’re so sensitive.

I heard copper is going to be the new gold in a few years, might wanna look into that as well ;)

Dude big Ron just goes off when ever you mention anything about PCars. He doesnt go off if you mention anything about Assetto Corsa, RFactor 2, RRRE or anything else.

So tell me, how is that a respectful way of acting? How are those the actions of someone who is “highly respected” and “well spoken” as you put it?

Sounds more like some child who has a love affair (hmmm maybe due to money being involved??) with a certain video game, and gets his panties caught up in a bunch if you say one wrong thing about it.

He was probably that kid in school who tattletaled on every other kid in class and made everyone hate him.

The game is not a pre-alpha dude, its a well progressing Alpha, look up what pre-alpha means, it hasnt been pre-alpha since, well pretty much forever. They just use that term to make people think the game has barely gotten off the chalkboard if you know what I mean.

Lots of the cars are driveable and feel fun. That doesnt mean the cars act like a sim. Go play Game Stock Car, RFactor 2 or Netkar Pro, then go back to PCars, and you will find out what the word sim really means.

F1C was never ported to consoles. The console version was not based on the ISI/ Pre-RFactor engine, couldnt you feel it when you played it? I noticed it within 15 seconds. Maybe you never played it. Anyways the console version was made by a completely different company called Visual Science, only the PC version was made by ISI. The console and PC versions are pretty much 2 completely different games.

Shift 1 and 2 are complete jokes on console and PC.

Ya, F1 for consoles was a completely different game made by a company called Visual Science.

Ya its getting more sim like every week, its pretty obvious, constant graphics updates, constant flurry of pictures (which people still feel the need to shrink and re-size as if the game didnt look good enough already), constant flashy videos with cool dubstep, its clearly becoming a sim more and more every week.

Yup I too am disapointed in PCars graphics when I compare them to all these pics. Its like 2 different games.

Still looks beautiful though.

Also make sure you keep up with the 1, 2, 3+ years of updates RFactor 2 has in store for us, IRacing has years of updates as well (if you can get on with their pricing model), I am sure Assetto Corsa will have many updates as well :) PCars isnt the only game with time left in its development, just because it has a year left doesnt mean its going to be some God made sim remember that.

Im sure it will be an awesomely fun game, but I highly, highly, highly doubt it will be Assetto Corsa/RFactor 2/Reiza Studios/Richard Burns Rally/Live for Speed (if it ever makes it to S3) type sim though, those are the sims that you could honestly think of as a poor mans industrial type sim, like a training tool, rather than a video game.

Project Gotham 2 and 4 were by far the best of the series in terms of the actual handling and driving dynamics, I actually thought part 3 was the worst, and part 1 wasnt bad, the drifting felt awesome in 1, but it felt like the cars were setup to drift, maybe a little too smooth and easy, like a purpose built drift car.

Just like how the Pro drivers helped the physics of the Shift series become such a beautiful peice of simulation software?

I would think the development team know better than anyone what state their own game is in. If they don’t regard it to have reached alpha yet, then it hasn’t. It’s not like they’re rock-solid categories after all.

Just like how EA intended Shift to be a piece of simulation software, right?

I played Iracing, Rfactor 1&2, GTR1&2, LFS and YES, PCARS is a simulation.

Sigh… Not this again… How about yourself learning about software development cycles.

This sim is very far from /feature complete/ (missing stuff: single player career, quick races, online features, setup features, many cars, some tracks etc.). Many of the current implemented features are in mid development. It has not yet entered the /alpha testing stage/. What does that tell you?

No I don’t see it like that I have been somewhat critical in the WMD forums recently and Big Ron has not been giving me problems with some of the posts I have made against the will of the community because I think he understands that it is only my goal to help make this Sim the best it can be and that I as always am on the developers side. I think it goes more into getting on people just making pop shots at this project that gets under his skin as it does mine as well. When you start being respectful I am sure Ron will give you respect!
Oh and as not to be misunderstood the you in this is a generalization and not directly pointed at you. I have seen that you now are posting your positive thoughts along with the negative so yes your posts have improved.

Well Yes I think some of the cars are too glued to the track at the present time other elements will be worked on to counteract this going forward. No I cannot fully understand the whole process of development since I do not do it myself but to assume the cars will stay in their current state is the wrong outlook IMO.

I actually played F1 World GP and F1 Simulator (by UBI) at that time. Still impressive driving a full championship with full grid, damage and weather for its time, unfortunately in many newer games that’s not possible at all (GT, Forza, S2U the grids and championships feels to fantasy-like and not (semi)real ) . Probably one of the many reasons why it couldn’t be ported even if they wanted to, at least for ~ mid-range PCs F1C and GTR2 were already quite heavy on PCs at that time.

I don’t know if that’s what they intended but Shift looks a bit inspired by more “filmic” feeling racing games like PGR or Grid. It’s not a bad concept _if_ you don’t sacrifice sim-ness, after all sometimes it’s fun just to put a sports cars on a track and drive without using your racing brain to much, but still not have complete arcade physics like Grid or… other car racing games.

I don’t think ISI engines should be used on consoles, but I wonder how rFactor 2 could run on next gen consoles (looks like both get 8 CPU cores @ 1.6 GHz) if anyone dares to create a true GT / Forza competitor for consoles :)

Ughhh NO, how about YOU learn?

PRE-ALPHA:
- Refers to all activities performed during the software project BEFORE testing. These activities can include requirements analysis, software design, software development, and unit testing. In typical open source development, there are several types of pre-alpha versions.

ALPHA:
- The alpha phase of the release life cycle is the first phase to begin software testing AKA RFactor 2 and Project Cars. In this phase, developers generally test the software using white box techniques (whatever that means). Additional validation is then performed using black box or gray box techniques , by another testing team. Moving to black box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release. (Ignore the white, grey, black box stuff, probably some internal stuff that doesnt concern us). Alpha software can be unstable and could cause crashes or data loss. The exception to this is when the alpha is available publicly (such as a pre-order bonus), in which developers normally push for stability so that their testers can test properly (that is all totally Project Cars and RFactor 2). THE ALPHA PHASE USUALLY ENDS WITH A FEATURE FREEZE, INDICATING THAT NO MORE FEATURES WILL BE ADDED TO THE SOFTWARE. At this time, the software is said to be feature complete. RFactor 2 and Project Cars are not at this stage yet as they still have features and fundamental software changes going on constantly, and so both are still totally in Alpha stage.

BETA:
- Beta generally begins WHEN THE SOFTWARE IS FEATURE COMPLETE. (CLEARLY this isnt RFactor 2). Software in the beta phase will generally have many more bugs in it than completed software, as well as speed/performance issues.

NOTE:
- Some software is kept in perpetual beta—where new features and functionality are continually added to the software without establishing a firm “final” release. AKA iRacing, and supposedly RFactor 2 will be like this as well.

As you can see, in the traditional sense, PCars is an Alpha and by no means a pre-alpha, also, RFactor 2 is actually an Alpha, and in no means a Beta.

Sometimes you have to ignore what the developer labels the product, and just come to your own conlusions, as some devs unfortunately like to throw the pre-alpha, alpha and beta names around with no concern for their true meaning.

LOL comment of the year so far. I guess shift 1 and 2 are sims as well? What about Test drive Ferrari Legends, is that a sim to you as well? Wait you consider WRC, Grid, Dirt and Codies F1 games sims too? I dont think you have the ability and understanding to differentiate the difference between a sim and a video game with some simish qualities.

Also, the fact that you can get mods for shift 2 that feel more simish than PCars is hella sad bro.

The point is, hiring some racing drivers isnt going to turn a game into a sim. They give general feeling points, they dont have the ability to technically analyse the physics and handling model, they just say this feels ok, these feels like this, ok that feels pretty good for a video game, job done.

Dont be so fooled by marketing. Im assuming you go and buy a big mac at McDonalds and expect it to be nice and big everytime you see one on TV?

Use your head, dont fall for this stuff.

Double sigh… You can cut & paste, but not read and comprehend, I see.

“PRE-ALPHA:
- Refers to all activities performed during the software project BEFORE testing. These activities can include requirements analysis, software design, software development, and unit testing. In typical open source development, there are several types of pre-alpha versions.”

Yep, this is exactly were we are :-) As we speak, SMS is still working on software design and development, and being good coders, they’re surely doing unit tests. Requirements analysis is not over either – it happens on a running basis at detail level, using community input, and results in design changes and additions. This kind of development is highly agile.

“In this phase (ALPHA), developers generally test the software using white box techniques (whatever that means). Additional validation is then performed using black box or gray box techniques , by another testing team. Moving to black box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release.”

Right, and we’re not there yet. Alpha is about formal testing, and no such testing has begun, simply because it’s not ready for that – its’ still in the thick of the development phase, producing the systems which shall eventually be subjected to such testing. I also see from your “whatever that means” comment, that you have no idea what you’re talking about.

QED

As it happens, it’s not up to you to decide where in the development cycle the software is, especially since you obviously have no competence in this area. The development phase is given by the state of the software itself and decided by the devs responsible for moving it through the phases.

Why is it so important to you to ‘prove’ this (‘disproving’ SMS in the process), in spite of the facts telling the opposite? It’s not really about the development cycle on your part – it’s all about bashing the project in any possible way, and at all cost. Nothing new there.

You might notice that all I said about the consultants is that they’re giving useful advice. What makes or breaks a sim is the team coding the physics, which is why I mentioned them primarily.

Also, if every single post the consultants make on the forum is run through marketing then that department must be very busy indeed.

“2012 most overated game”
2013′s most overrated comment :-p

Funny how people slate a game that isnt finished! Havent played it but its good to read some of the rants on here. I mean i cant see the people who keep craving driving sims ever being happy! fs man jus go out and drive your car down some a-roads.