After reading Jan Kohl’s informative, calm, mature responses to my original criticisms of this mod, I gave it another go last night. I’m now a believer.

I’m guilty of two mistakes in my first impressions of this mod. One, I completely misinterpreted what this series was all about. I saw GT, and I immediately thought these were GT cars like those that compete in the FIA GT Championship or ALMS. Thanks to Jan and others, I’ve learned that’s not the case. These cars are pretty much production vehicles with roll cages bolted in that run on a pretty primitive racing tire, not a purpose-built race car.

So once I wrapped my head around that fact, this mod came alive. These cars aren’t as nimble as highly tuned sports cars or even a well-tuned FWD touring car. They can be beasts, depending on the car you choose, and must be driven that way.

Two, I think I may have made a mistake with RealFeel settings. For some reason, the default RealFeel felt much better with all cars except the Caddy last night. I’m thinking I may have not purchased or installed the RealFeel FFB force option in the Upgrades section of the Vehicle menu for each car I own. DOH! Yes, my embarrassment is total. :)

This mod really shines in many areas. First, the physics are different for each car. I was way wrong with that. The Caddy feels like a boat, the Porsche feels nimble, the Aston is very unstable under braking if you don’t blip the throttle, and the GTO and Volvo feel really balanced to me — all with default setups.

Second, the offline AI is very good, which is a plus. Third, the tire model for this mod might be the best I’ve ever experienced in rFactor in terms of matching how heavy, production-based cars like this must chew up tires in reality. You simply can’t drive these cars like a drifting mod, and that’s so refreshing. You really, really need to be tidy in your driving and pay attention to tire management, adding another mental aspect that so few rFactor mods include.

Fourth, I love how you must blip the throttle on downshifts with most cars. So few rFactor mods require this. Again, it develops a skill set that very few rFactor mods hone. Finally, these cars dance at the edge of grip as well as the fantastic Historic GT & Touring mod, which I think sets the benchmark for that in rFactor. I was able to catch slides in a few cars last night when reaching the end of the tire grip. So many rFactor mods at the edge resemble driving on black ice: You have gobs of grip and then suddenly the car is spinning toward the kitty litter. There’s no gray area of grip that gives you a split-second to catch the car. This mod does give you that minute frame of time.

So, I come to Jan and the US Pits with a heaping plate of fried black bird, ready to gobble some crow. You have done a very fine job with this mod. I think it’s misunderstood by some — including me at the outset — because it does a lot of things that haven’t been modeled well before in rFactor. So the knee-jerk reaction from some blowhards like me is to immediately assume that those are flaws when in reality they’re plusses that are advancing this sim to places it hasn’t been before.

Thanks.

NAGT is defenetly a highclass Mod…with a bunch of several diffrent 3dModells.
Thats what we have to recognize and what we have to reflect first.

“One-Car” One 3D Modell Mods are really diffrent and much more easier to create….but this Multi3d Mod hits totally the Quality of AussiesV8 Mod..PCC05/07 too.

I have to say..Congrats NAGT Team !
Thats only what its deserve..nothing other subjectives “Fanclubbings” !

In this Sense
Holger

First off, for everyone having RealFeel problems, just play with it. The mod is not “broken,” mine worked perfectly the first time I fired it up FFB-wise, using 540 degrees of steering. I just had to play with MaxForceAtSteeringRack a little.

I have a question for NAGT, if he’s still reading this: why didn’t you just name this mod “SPEED GT”? That’s what these cars all are, after all.

I’m a huge SPEED GT fan, and you’ve included my boy Eric Curran and his Corvette, so you’ve already won me over!

The sounds are awesome… the cockpit textures are not Power and Glory/Historic GT levels of awesome, but people whining are exaggerating quite a bit–they look just fine.

The physics are easily on par with similar cars in GTR2 (at least within the limits of RealFeel’s FFB), and are very easy to drive at 8/10, and very challenging to drive right at the limit. I also noticed that the cars WILL punish you for downshifting early or braking too hard by snapping around–the mod definitely teaches smoothness and patience.

If I wasn’t already so engrossed in a HistorX league, I might’ve started one up for this mod–it’s great!

Paul, would you please provide a link to Kangaloosh controller.ini? Is that the controller available along with the plugin? Thanks.

I only use 360 degrees of rotation. Could that be the difference maker?

Appreciate the feedback, man. My experience is the exact opposite — I have no feel in the wheel whatsoever with the prescribed RealFeel settings. What kind of wheel are you using? I’m using a DFP with default RealFeel controller.ini in Windows Game Controllers — 100 FFB, 0 everything else, Low in-game FFB, cut-and-paste FFB for controller.ini provided by Kangaloosh, who made RealFeel with TechAde. At 3500, I feel nothing. At 2600, the forces are stronger, but as I said, it feels like a constant tire grip force, like that produced by Leo’s FFB. There’s no subtlety at all, like with the Historics or another mod made for RealFeel. Something tells me this mod, because it was in development for three years, was not made around RealFeel. I’d bet the modders had their own suspension models and then tried to dial in RealFeel settings that felt decent with the mod. It doesn’t really work, IMO. Still, I appreciate all of the work the modders did with NAGT. But it doesn’t drive well at all with RealFeel, which is a bummer.

First, the good things. Or more accurately, countering some of the complaints. I really like the tire model. You can keep the tires in the 190-205 F range if you don’t slide all over the racetrack. This isn’t a drifting mod; these cars don’t run in 30-minute touring car races. If you treat the tires with respect, they will provide excellent grip in the 190-205 F range. I really like how the tire model punishes you for sliding too much. Well done.

Plus, much ado about nothing regarding the cockpit interiors. Yes, they’re plain. But they’re not horrible, by any stretch. Some of the complaints here made me think that I would see cockpits like Codemasters’ original TOCA game back in the late 90s. Hardly.

Also, the Caddy, Vete, Aston and Viper each looked fine and had acceptable solo framerates with my machine running on DX 7. I’m still not happy that certain cars don’t run right or well in DX 7/8, but the four previously mentioned cars run fine, with proper mirrors.

But it’s time for the other shoe to drop, sadly. This mod really falls flat with its physics and suspension modeling.

The physics of the four cars that I drove, which have unique characteristics, didn’t feel that much different. And that’s because I think the suspensions for these cars have flaws. They lack the wonderful “feel” of mods built with proper suspensions, usually with carFactory.

Sorry, but this mod just feels dead at the wheel. You feel constant forces, but absolutely nothing subtle through the steering rack when driving this mod with RealFeel. Just a constant tire grip force, almost like you’d feel when running Leo’s FFB plug-in with Low in-game FFB settings.

I thought maybe the problem was dodgy suggested RealFeel settings by the modders, and it was. The MaxForceAtSteeringRack figure of 3500 is much too high for the forces generated by these cars. I tested numerous laps with all four cars at Mid-Ohio and Oulton Island GP 2005 — two of the best test tracks for RealFeel in rFactor due to their accurate bump simulation, elevation changes and varying corners — with MoTec, and the MaxForceAtSteeringRack should be set around 2600, based on MoTeC telemetry. But even setting RealFeel with that proper force figure, this mod is dead at the wheel.

There’s no subtlety in steering rack forces through the suspension at all. For comparison, I jumped straight from a Viper to a Caterham — which was developed to work perfectly with RealFeel — and the difference was startling. The Caterham had all sorts of minute forces being transmitted through the wheel at Mid-Ohio. The car felt alive, whereas the Viper, Vette, Caddy and Aston I just drove around the same track felt like a Barcalounger.

I suppose if you don’t insist on using RealFeel as I do, this mod has real promise. But if you’re a RealFeel zealot like me, this mod’s suspensions just aren’t designed to work with RealFeel, especially not at the defaults suggested by the modders.

Too bad, as I know plenty of hard work went into this mod.

But NAGT just lacks any feel compared to quality mods that work well with RealFeel and were either built with proper suspensions or built with carFactory, such as Caterham, RealFeel-tweaked rTrainers, Historic GT & Touring, 1955 F1, Grand Prix 1979 and more.

Where’s your cockpits? Where’s your sound files?

Have you ever opened up an SCCA rulebook and read and understood the series’ rules? I have. It’s called performance balancing.

Before you people continue your incessant and trivial whining, why don’t you spend a litte time away from your games, get out and learn some real valuable information, and get a clue!

Analysis in suspedit bears this out… totaly horendous front end geometry, steering arms are above and to the rear of front centerline…

NAGT team, revert to the old 0.80 physics!